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Electoral College Coup

After back-to-back presidential losses, Republicans in key states want to change the rules to make it easier for them to win.

http://www.toledonewsnow.com/story/20620462/gop-eyes-new-election-laws

So the Republican’s thought is here, faced with fact their largest single demographic is the quickly shrinking base of old white men; they are looking to rig the electoral vote to help them win Presidential elections. They have little chance of expanding their base because their message and ideas simply don’t appeal to gays, minorities, the young, women or immigrants in significant numbers to help them win elections.

So now Republicans want to give the bulk of solid or increasingly solid blue state elector votes to Republicans regardless that the states popular vote wanted to vote for the democratic candidate. In Pennsylvania, Obama won by over 5% of the popular vote, taking Pennsylvania’s 20 electoral votes. Under the Republican’s coup, Obama would have received 7 electoral votes and Romney would have gotten 13. They are looking to so the same thing in Ohio, Wisconsin and Michigan.

All this talk about slippery slopes and the constitution, but a single political party is looking to rig elections to make it nearly impossible for them lose a Presidential election and I sadly look to slippery slope caucus to remain silent.

created by SensorG on Jan 18, 2013 at 09:36:01 am     Politics     Comments: 49

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Comments ... #

Let's face it, both parties do their best to "rig" elections. Whether through gerrymandering, ridiculous standards to get on the ballot, etc. To me, the electoral college is an antiquated system that gives 40-45 of the states essentially no say in the presidential elections. Populous states like Texas, Arizona, California and New York get nothing.

The only thing worse than the electoral system is the primary system. Why the hell should Iowa, New Hampshire and South Carolina be the ones to determine who the parties should nominate? They are hardly bellweather states. Once the primaries are over, the candidates never return. There should definitely be some sort of rotating system allowing groups of states to be in the mix. Five primary dates, three weeks apart, 10 states in each. Not Northeast, Southeast, Southwest and Northwest either.

posted by Ace_Face on Jan 18, 2013 at 11:49:03 am     #  

The logical choice to replace the college with would be the popular vote.

posted by SensorG on Jan 18, 2013 at 12:37:21 pm     #  

No, it wouldn't.

posted by Wulf on Jan 18, 2013 at 12:52:33 pm     #  

So what would? A rigged college is better than a popular vote?

posted by SensorG on Jan 18, 2013 at 12:55:37 pm     #  

Get rid of the electoral college and replace the current mutually exclusive voting system with a ranked voting system. One possible addition to a ranked system would be the ability to cast a single vote against a candidate, but that wouldn't be necessary to make the system work.

The electoral college hasn't been used correctly since the beginning of the 20th century. Get rid of it, and at the same time get rid of the useless mutually exclusive system we have now.

posted by madjack on Jan 18, 2013 at 01:15:33 pm     #  

pink_slip, when someone posts "obama has a big problem", it's not because of any health bill, it's because HE'S GONNA LOSE THE ELECTION!

! posted by Wulf on Apr 27, 2012 at 11:35:43 am # +

Wolf hasn gotten over the OBAMA"s WIN! Hence rigging is not a bad idea in his myopic view of the world.

posted by holland on Jan 18, 2013 at 01:21:42 pm     #   2 people liked this

holland posted at 12:21:42 PM on Jan 18, 2013:

pink_slip, when someone posts "obama has a big problem", it's not because of any health bill, it's because HE'S GONNA LOSE THE ELECTION!

! posted by Wulf on Apr 27, 2012 at 11:35:43 am # +

Wolf hasn gotten over the OBAMA"s WIN! Hence rigging is not a bad idea in his myopic view of the world.

Really? All that from "no it wouldn't."
A tie-in to a dug up 9 month old post?
Wow. Elephants never forget. (Ivory joke, sorry)

Well, speaking of grudges and old threads, I just want you to know that I got over you telling me that I was sleeping with Dr. Reese because I praised him for saving my sibling's life. Hopefully we can move past it so that it doesn't pollute future discussions.

posted by justread on Jan 18, 2013 at 01:29:02 pm     #  

Based on the latest Gallup poll 63% of Americans, including majorities of Republicans, Democrats, and Independents all support eliminating the electoral college.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/159881/americans-call-term-limits-end-electoral-college.aspx

From a local interests standpoint though you would have to agree if we did away with the electoral college there would also be far less money flowing into the Toledo Market every 4 years.

posted by glasscityguy on Jan 18, 2013 at 01:46:32 pm     #  

HaHaHaHa!!! I don't think so! You're the one that keeps bringing it up. Thanks for the laugh. I mean really. Its down right funny.

You're really touchy on that subject. BTW if you remember I questioned the possibility. I didn't say you had.

What's that old Shakespear quote? "The lady doth protest too much?"

posted by holland on Jan 18, 2013 at 01:48:21 pm     #  

Great. Glad that we can put that behind us.

posted by justread on Jan 18, 2013 at 01:53:54 pm     #  

Back to the original point – We are about to have a single party rig the Electoral College so they can win all future elections. If the point of the second amendment is to protect the people from the government, when do you start protecting? You shrugged at the Patriot Act and you shrug when it looks like the Electoral College is going to get rigged. No one in the government wants to take your guns away; you’ve already been rendered impotent with apathy.

posted by SensorG on Jan 18, 2013 at 03:29:52 pm     #   3 people liked this

You shrugged at the Patriot Act...

Ah yes, the original sin. Because nothing that has happened after 2002 matters.

Remind me again who reauthorized the dreaded-hated-Republican-freedom-hating-bastard Patriot Act on May 26th, 2011? With an AutoPen (meaning he cared so much he didn't even bother to hand sign it).

Oh, never mind, I'll just paste it from Wikipedia...

On May 26, 2011, President Barack Obama used an Autopen to sign a four-year extension of three key provisions in the USA PATRIOT Act while he was in France: roving wiretaps, searches of business records (the "library records provision"), and conducting surveillance of "lone wolves" — individuals suspected of terrorist-related activities not linked to terrorist groups.

Please stop pretending that one side is to blame for every fucking thing. I point you to Illinois and California --two states where Republicans control nothing ...and yet "rigging" goes on. (D) doesn't have any special halos that I can see. To pretend that the (D) side doesn't try to gain political advantage by any means necessary is just intellectually dishonest.

By the way, I hate the Patriot Act. But it is plainly obvious that the (D) currently in power (who could veto veto veto and veto the thing...especially now that his re-election is behind him) likes the power at his and his administration's disposal.

posted by oldhometown on Jan 18, 2013 at 03:47:20 pm     #  

Every administration likes all the power they can get at their disposal.

Gerrymandering is one thing, but actually changing the way to award college votes has never been done. BTW – In CA, congressional districts are drawn by a bipartisan commission. Something all states should do.

posted by SensorG on Jan 18, 2013 at 04:00:22 pm     #   4 people liked this

Every administration likes all the power they can get at their disposal.

Not an excuse. You did not and would not accept that answer (or shrug it off) if GWB was still president.

posted by oldhometown on Jan 18, 2013 at 04:04:40 pm     #  

Patriot act sucks. Threatening to ban guns sucks.
Manipulating the electoral college sucks.

Ok, now what do we argue about?

Does the Clinton BJ have a home here?

posted by justread on Jan 18, 2013 at 04:08:12 pm     #  

justread posted at 12:29:02 PM on Jan 18, 2013:
holland posted at 12:21:42 PM on Jan 18, 2013:

pink_slip, when someone posts "obama has a big problem", it's not because of any health bill, it's because HE'S GONNA LOSE THE ELECTION!

! posted by Wulf on Apr 27, 2012 at 11:35:43 am # +

Wolf hasn gotten over the OBAMA"s WIN! Hence rigging is not a bad idea in his myopic view of the world.

Really? All that from "no it wouldn't."
A tie-in to a dug up 9 month old post?

Wow. Elephants never forget. (Ivory joke, sorry)

Well, speaking of grudges and old threads, I just want you to know that I got over you telling me that I was sleeping with Dr. Reese because I praised him for saving my sibling's life. Hopefully we can move past it so that it doesn't pollute future discussions.

The lapdog to the rescue!

posted by researcher on Jan 18, 2013 at 05:31:23 pm     #   1 person liked this

oldhometown posted at 02:47:20 PM on Jan 18, 2013:

You shrugged at the Patriot Act...

Ah yes, the original sin. Because nothing that has happened after 2002 matters.

Remind me again who reauthorized the dreaded-hated-Republican-freedom-hating-bastard Patriot Act on May 26th, 2011? With an AutoPen (meaning he cared so much he didn't even bother to hand sign it).

Oh, never mind, I'll just paste it from Wikipedia...

On May 26, 2011, President Barack Obama used an Autopen to sign a four-year extension of three key provisions in the USA PATRIOT Act while he was in France: roving wiretaps, searches of business records (the "library records provision"), and conducting surveillance of "lone wolves" — individuals suspected of terrorist-related activities not linked to terrorist groups.

Please stop pretending that one side is to blame for every fucking thing. I point you to Illinois and California --two states where Republicans control nothing ...and yet "rigging" goes on. (D) doesn't have any special halos that I can see. To pretend that the (D) side doesn't try to gain political advantage by any means necessary is just intellectually dishonest.

By the way, I hate the Patriot Act. But it is plainly obvious that the (D) currently in power (who could veto veto veto and veto the thing...especially now that his re-election is behind him) likes the power at his and his administration's disposal.

To do otherwise would have had Limbaugh, Beck, and Fox News Channel running wall-to-wall coverage of how Obama hates America, loves terrorists (being a secret Muslim himself), and how he just enabled jihadis to walk in and start raping our wives and daughters while taking our jobs.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 18, 2013 at 05:36:28 pm     #   3 people liked this

To do otherwise would have had Limbaugh, Beck, and Fox News Channel running wall-to-wall coverage of how Obama hates America, loves terrorists (being a secret Muslim himself), and how he just enabled jihadis to walk in and start raping our wives and daughters while taking our jobs.

1.) And that differs how from what they say about him now (a bit of hyperbole about terrorists coming in to take our jobs, but yeah--they don't like him anyway)?

2.) And, given the results of the 2012 election, what difference does it make in the least what they say about him? To quote the President, "[he] won." All this hoo-ha over conservative media having so much power......umm, results say otherwise currently.

As I said previously, there's no way you or Sensor would ever accept "Every administration likes all the power they can get at their disposal" as an answer if GWB, McCain, or Romney was in power.

But crickets chirp when a President you like (auto)signs to reauthorize the most restrictive rights bill ever passed. Yes it was passed by Republicans. Yes. Yes-Yes-Yes. But that fact, from 2002 in the wake of a terrorist attack, does not stop him from exercising his veto power in 2011, 2013, or any point in the future. Especially now.

It's all about the power. Always. (D) & (R).

posted by oldhometown on Jan 18, 2013 at 05:47:53 pm     #  

SensorG posted at 03:00:22 PM on Jan 18, 2013:

Every administration likes all the power they can get at their disposal.

Gerrymandering is one thing, but actually changing the way to award college votes has never been done. BTW – In CA, congressional districts are drawn by a bipartisan commission. Something all states should do.

Gerrymandering is one thing, but actually changing the way to award college votes has never been done.

Nope. Has never been done.

Maine
1820-1828: Congressional District Method
1832-1968: Winner Take All Method
1972-Present: Congressional District/Statewide Method

Nebraska
1868-1988: Winner Take All Method
1992-Present: Congressional District/Statewide Method

posted by RBancroft on Jan 18, 2013 at 06:31:30 pm     #  

oldhometown posted at 04:47:53 PM on Jan 18, 2013:

To do otherwise would have had Limbaugh, Beck, and Fox News Channel running wall-to-wall coverage of how Obama hates America, loves terrorists (being a secret Muslim himself), and how he just enabled jihadis to walk in and start raping our wives and daughters while taking our jobs.

1.) And that differs how from what they say about him now (a bit of hyperbole about terrorists coming in to take our jobs, but yeah--they don't like him anyway)?

2.) And, given the results of the 2012 election, what difference does it make in the least what they say about him? To quote the President, "[he] won." All this hoo-ha over conservative media having so much power......umm, results say otherwise currently.

As I said previously, there's no way you or Sensor would ever accept "Every administration likes all the power they can get at their disposal" as an answer if GWB, McCain, or Romney was in power.

But crickets chirp when a President you like (auto)signs to reauthorize the most restrictive rights bill ever passed. Yes it was passed by Republicans. Yes. Yes-Yes-Yes. But that fact, from 2002 in the wake of a terrorist attack, does not stop him from exercising his veto power in 2011, 2013, or any point in the future. Especially now.

It's all about the power. Always. (D) & (R).

You mean the bill that only addressed three provisions of the Patriot Act?

The provisions empower law enforcement officials to get court approval to obtain "roving wiretaps" on suspected foreign agents with multiple modes of communications, track noncitizen "lone wolves" suspected of terrorism, and obtain certain business and even library records.

Court approval = warrant? Okay fine.
Track noncitizens? They're not exactly guaranteed Constitutional protections.
Guess which provision I'm not at all thrilled about? Yeah, the last one.

I'm not out to defend Obama on this though. He's pissing me off a lot. However, I'm pragmatic enough to understand that with Congress being a massive clusterfuck of gridlock, getting ANY bills out of them that are even 66% decent is a miracle.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 18, 2013 at 08:37:27 pm     #  

I think this is unrelated to the electoral college, but it's still good stuff.

January 17, 2013 - Electronic Frontier Foundation :
What the FBI Doesn't Want You To Know About Its 'Secret' Surveillance Techniques

These are just excerpts from the above link:

Though the FBI won’t release the memos, we do have some information from other sources on the surveillance techniques federal agents are already using. And for the most part the FBI contends they do not need a warrant, and one wonders, given the public nature of this information, why they are officially claiming its "secret."

Cell Phone Data Requests

Tellingly, in U.S. v. Jones, after the US government lost its case in the Supreme Court with the GPS device, it went right back to the district court and asserted it could get Jones’ cell phone site location data without a warrant.

The FBI employs highly controversial “tower dumps” where they get the location information on everyone within a particular radius, potentially violating the privacy of thousands of innocent people with one request.

Stingray Interceptors

In late 2012, we reported on the secretive new device the FBI has been increasingly using for surveillance known as a IMSI catcher, or “Stingray.” A Stingray acts as a fake cell phone tower and locks onto all devices in a certain area to find a cell phone’s location, or perhaps even intercept phone calls and texts. Given it potentially sucks up thousands of innocent persons’ data, we called it an “unconstitutional, all you can eat data buffet.”

The FBI has gone to great lengths to keep this technology secret, even going as far as refusing to tell judges its full range of capabilities.

License Plate Readers

In cities across the country, local police departments and other law enforcement agencies are installing automated license plate readers that create databases of location information about individual cars (and their drivers). These readers can be mounted by the side of a busy road, scanning every car that rolls by, or on the dash of a police car, allowing officers to drive through and scan all the plates in a parking lot.

This surveillance is untargeted, recording the movements of any car passes by. In cities that have become partners in the FBI’s Joint Terrorism Task Force, or have entered into another data-sharing agreement, this location information is at the fingertips of those federal agents.

Drone Authorization

On top of all this, the FBI is one of just a few dozen public agencies that has an authorization to fly a drone in the U.S. There is no evidence at this time that they are actively pursuing or using a specific device. But we do know that other branches of the federal government, namely the Department of Homeland Security (DHS), are conducting drone surveillance along the U.S. border, and have at least occasionally loaned these capabilities to other departments. EFF has sued DHS for more information about that program, but in the meantime, as with the redacted documents, information about their use in surveillance remains frustratingly opaque.

Secret Law

This is just the latest example of the Obama administration trying to interpret public laws in secret without adequately informing its citizens. Currently, EFF is suing the government for its secret interpretation of the Patriot Act Section 215, and for secret FISA court opinions that could shed light on the NSA warrantless wiretapping program. In addition, the ACLU has sued the Obama administration for its legal opinion stating it can kill US citizens overseas, away from the battlefield.

Of course, law enforcement needs the ability to conduct investigations. But explaining to the public how it generally conducts surveillance puts no one in danger, and compromises no investigations.

This information is vital to know if law enforcement is complying with the law and constitution. As we’ve seen with GPS devices, and we are now seeing with cell phone tracking and the use of Stingrays, law enforcement will push the limits of their authority — and sometimes overstep it — if they are not kept in check by an informed public.

But if we obey the "laws" and have nothing to hide, then we have nothing to worry about.

posted by jr on Jan 18, 2013 at 09:20:31 pm     #  

Looks like Virginia is going to one up it now.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2013/01/group-working-to-end-electoral-college-condemns-gops-indefensible-virginia-scheme.php

Under their plan, Obama, the winner of the state’s popular vote would have receive only 4 of Virginia’s 13 college votes. That’s crazy, Republicans will loose the state and still get 70% of the electoral college votes.

I guess when you’ve run out of ideas, have no interest in governing and refuse to expand your ever shirking base, rigging the system is all you have left.

Funny how Obama gets compared to a third world dictator all the time, but Republicans want to rig the system so they always win the Presidency just like a true a third world dictatorship.

posted by SensorG on Jan 24, 2013 at 02:43:54 pm     #   3 people liked this

Why are always so bitter? How high did your taxes go up?

posted by Wulf on Jan 24, 2013 at 05:03:24 pm     #  

Bitter, not at all. It's while everyone is focusing on guns, we’re truly losing the republic.

posted by SensorG on Jan 24, 2013 at 05:10:09 pm     #  

WE lost he republic a while back like 1965 or so.

posted by Linecrosser on Jan 24, 2013 at 05:59:13 pm     #   1 person liked this

Linecrosser posted at 04:59:13 PM on Jan 24, 2013:

WE lost he republic a while back like 1965 or so.

Yeah, ain't that the truth. I'm not real sure what we have now, but I am sure of what we don't have: a prosperous nation.

posted by madjack on Jan 24, 2013 at 09:34:29 pm     #  

madjack posted at 08:34:29 PM on Jan 24, 2013:
Linecrosser posted at 04:59:13 PM on Jan 24, 2013:

WE lost he republic a while back like 1965 or so.

Yeah, ain't that the truth. I'm not real sure what we have now, but I am sure of what we don't have: a prosperous nation.

Eisenhower made the "military-industrial complex" speech in 1961.

Civil Rights Act of 1964 and Voting Rights Act of 1965.

So yeah, keep being angry white guys.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 25, 2013 at 12:34:22 am     #  

I fully welcome the Dems to try to amend the Constitution to remove the electoral college.

It's too bad for them that requires 2/3rds ratification and amending the EC to Congressional Districts just requires each state to pass it's own bill.

posted by MikeyA on Jan 25, 2013 at 02:53:55 pm     #  

Note: The Dems had no problem with proportional voting when the President won an EV in Nebraska.

posted by MikeyA on Jan 25, 2013 at 02:55:14 pm     #  

MikeyA posted at 01:53:55 PM on Jan 25, 2013:

I fully welcome the Dems to try to amend the Constitution to remove the electoral college.

It's too bad for them that requires 2/3rds ratification and amending the EC to Congressional Districts just requires each state to pass it's own bill.

Yep - Republicans won't ever vote for a level playing field. They'd never win again.

I don't think the popular vote is the right way to go either, but I'll take the popular vote over a rigged electoral college.

posted by SensorG on Jan 25, 2013 at 02:56:58 pm     #  

So the electoral college is rigged in Nebraska and Maine? Remember who benefitted from it in '08.

posted by MikeyA on Jan 25, 2013 at 03:43:02 pm     #  

The electoral college has been set up in Nebraska and Maine for a long, long time. Who benefited in 2008? So Obama took a single electoral point in Nebraska in 2008, hardly real benefit considering the shellacking Obama gave McCain. Obama didn’t get the vote in 2012, but it was close.

Ironically Nebraska will be going to a winner take all system, to make sure it never happens again.

posted by SensorG on Jan 25, 2013 at 04:04:52 pm     #  

MikeyA posted at 02:43:02 PM on Jan 25, 2013:

So the electoral college is rigged in Nebraska and Maine? Remember who benefitted from it in '08.

Obama also won 51% of the popular vote. You Teabaggers want to rig it so once again you can have another Bush win the EC and fail at the popular vote.

Try again, Mr. Epic Fail Troll.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 25, 2013 at 05:41:23 pm     #  

"Yep - Republicans won't ever vote for a level playing field. They'd never win again."

LOL. You seem to not understand the concept of fair. Knowing the rules before the election itself makes it a level playing field. Everyone then knows what they need to accomplish.

"Obama also won 51% of the popular vote. You Teabaggers want to rig it so once again you can have another Bush win the EC and fail at the popular vote.

Try again, Mr. Epic Fail Troll."

Actually AC on Swampbubbles I was advocating this very change as opposed to the popular vote PRIOR to the election. http://swampbubbles.com/20120910/voter-fraud-does-not-exist-wait

If every state did it then it would mirror the popular vote in the Presidental election almost exactly.

And despite your whining this is not a product of the Tea Party trying to change the results based upon the 2012 election. They proposed it in 2010. I guess they could see into the future eh? http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/19/us/politics/pennsylvania-republicans-weigh-electoral-vote-changes.html?_r=0

How is it any different than what California and other states are doing legally with the NPVIC? http://justenrichment.com/2011/08/09/california-joins-crusade-against-the-electoral-college/

AC this is no different than the nuclear option debate where you said "Ohio families don't like Republican a**holes who disregard Senate rules (which is what the "nuclear" option was all about) or tradition. Nor do they like groups who act in threatening ways, like these conservative a**holes."

So I pose to you now will you admit that Harry Reid is an A**hole for proposing the use of the nuclear option? http://www.theatlanticwire.com/politics/2013/01/harry-reid-filibuster/61291/

or because he actually used it. http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/186133-reid-triggers-nuclear-option-to-change-senate-rules-and-prohibit-post-cloture-filibusters

Quit your whining. If the Dems had a chance to gerrymander they would have and they have used it in the past.

Don't be such a p*ssy all the time.

posted by MikeyA on Jan 25, 2013 at 06:30:41 pm     #  

Your a party of losers and no ideas. Americans are increasing rejecting you. Cheating is all you have left.

posted by SensorG on Jan 25, 2013 at 10:59:14 pm     #  

Americans seemed to chose conservatives in 2010, wasn't much of a change for either side in 2012, guess we will see in 2014, how the people view the job done by the current elected officials.

posted by Linecrosser on Jan 26, 2013 at 12:07:31 am     #  

Don't be such a p*ssy all the time.

He can't help it. He belongs to a party that is chock-full of p*ssies and pantywaists.

If the Dems had a chance to gerrymander they would have and they have used it in the past.

The Dems have had their chances and have tried as well. In 2004, Dems in Colorado tried to push an amendment to the state constitution switching the state from winner take all to proportional selection. It failed with 2 out of every 3 voters voting against the measure. Which means a good number of Dems, who initially supported, jumped ship right before the election because it was at polling 51% For/37% Against one month prior.

Paraphrasing what Ace said at the outset, both parties have tried and will continue to try maneuvers like this. The libs need to come down from Mount Moral High Ground where they don't belong.

posted by RBancroft on Jan 26, 2013 at 12:18:16 am     #  

LOL I must have hit a nerve on Sensor.

Sensor you are the party who went nuclear not us.

The GOP with this is no diff than the Cali link I pointed out. If it is different then show me.

You have the majority and all you do is whine. When you did have the full majority all you did is whine.

posted by MikeyA on Jan 26, 2013 at 12:51:27 am     #  

RBancroft posted at 11:18:16 PM on Jan 25, 2013:

Don't be such a p*ssy all the time.

He can't help it. He belongs to a party that is chock-full of p*ssies and pantywaists.

If the Dems had a chance to gerrymander they would have and they have used it in the past.

The Dems have had their chances and have tried as well. In 2004, Dems in Colorado tried to push an amendment to the state constitution switching the state from winner take all to proportional selection. It failed with 2 out of every 3 voters voting against the measure. Which means a good number of Dems, who initially supported, jumped ship right before the election because it was at polling 51% For/37% Against one month prior.

Paraphrasing what Ace said at the outset, both parties have tried and will continue to try maneuvers like this. The libs need to come down from Mount Moral High Ground where they don't belong.

Woah, there partner! Have you listened to any Republicans lately? They don't sound like wimps to you?

posted by researcher on Jan 26, 2013 at 01:45:07 am     #  

MikeyA posted at 11:51:27 PM on Jan 25, 2013:

LOL I must have hit a nerve on Sensor.

Sensor you are the party who went nuclear not us.

The GOP with this is no diff than the Cali link I pointed out. If it is different then show me.

You have the majority and all you do is whine. When you did have the full majority all you did is whine.

Now that you are a pile of losers all you do is whine and work on how to "win" by rigging the system, instead of fixing the problems inside your own party... meanwhile, somewhere, another Republican dumbass is talking about "legitimate rape" or teaching Creationism or how science is the tool of Satan.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 26, 2013 at 02:46:38 pm     #  

So you can't explain how what CA has done with the popular vote iniative is different than the source article then?

I rest my case. Until you can quit whining.

posted by MikeyA on Jan 26, 2013 at 11:52:01 pm     #  

So Mike are you bitching about going to the popular vote or fighting it?

posted by SensorG on Jan 27, 2013 at 01:00:32 pm     #  

So Mike are you bitching about going to the popular vote or fighting it?

posted by SensorG on Jan 27, 2013 at 01:00:33 pm     #  

As fore the nuclear option, it's dead. Reid surrendered on Filibuster reform. 60 votes will be need to do anything.

posted by SensorG on Jan 27, 2013 at 02:18:25 pm     #  

I'm not bitching about the National Popular Vote Iniative. It's completely legal. Most states however are not buying it.

So unless you can get enough states to buy off on it then you must amend the Constitution. So, go write your amendment and get 2/3rds of the states to ratify it. I wish you good luck.

"As fore the nuclear option, it's dead. Reid surrendered on Filibuster reform. 60 votes will be need to do anything." No, actually it wasn't the GOP who used it for non-budget related matters it was Reid and the Dems. Yet for all the whining I heard on this very site back in 2005 you'd have thought it was the end of the world. So spare me your whines about the Tea Party trying to steal elections bullshit. If the roles were reversed the Dems would do the same then and they are with the NPVI.

posted by MikeyA on Jan 27, 2013 at 08:22:39 pm     #  

First thing, I'm not for NPVI, but in the end it's about making the winner of the popular vote the President. What the Republicans are trying to do is make sure an every decreasing minority of people get to decide who is president because the American people have rejected their ideas and don't want them to win.

posted by SensorG on Jan 28, 2013 at 10:12:40 am     #  

Well the NPVI is something that the Dems are doing, they're trying to get rid of the one person one vote standard by invalidating the majority votes of a whole state.

"make sure an every decreasing minority of people get to decide who is president because the American people have rejected their ideas and don't want them to win." Actually no, the CD plan doesn't account for all the EV's. In that plan there are two EV's left over which represent the EV's for the Senator's in that state. Those are won by the person who receives the most votes in the state total. Which is why if you analyze every election in the last 60 years the CD plan aligns up with the popular vote. There are red states the Dems could benefit from this plan, Louisiana, Arkansas, Missouri, and Georgia. I personally have no problem if the Dems wanted to pursue this exact same thing in those states.

posted by MikeyA on Jan 28, 2013 at 10:41:47 am     #  

In Virginia, those two Senatorial votes would go to the winner of who took the most congressional districts. So in the case of Virginia, while Romney clearly lost the popular vote, he’d get 70% of the college votes…one person, one vote my ass.

Well the NPVI is something that the Dems are doing, they're trying to get rid of the one person one vote standard by invalidating the majority votes of a whole state.</>

How so? It simply gives makes the winner of the popular vote the winner. Where was the GOB scheme makes the looser the popular the winner.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Popular_Vote_Interstate_Compact

posted by SensorG on Jan 28, 2013 at 11:17:08 am     #  

And the Virginia plan has already been stopped in committe meaning it won't be brought to a vote at all. Why was it stopped in committee? Because the GOP Governor won't sign it into law!

Why won't he sign it into law? Because unless other states adopt CD plans their state AUTOMATICALLY becomes less important in the EC because everyone fairly knows which CD will vote for who barring one or two tossups.

So would a candidate focus on winner-take-all Ohio or 2 possible extra EC votes in VA?

posted by MikeyA on Jan 28, 2013 at 12:20:17 pm     #  

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