Toledo Talk

Collingwood Arts Center boots residents

https://www.facebook.com/CollingwoodArtsCenter/posts/658511450854465

"A Note from Sarah Kurfis, Executive Director, Collingwood Arts Center:

Since 1985, the Collingwood Arts Center (CAC) has been the home of many talented artists whose works do Toledo proud. Our building was finished in 1906. Due to our limited budget, we have been unable to upgrade the building. This has left us with significant electrical and plumbing issues that make it unsuitable to house full-time residents in 2014. As a result, the CAC will be ending our residency program.

Arriving at this decision was very difficult. This decision directly affects 28 artists that live and work within our facility. Many have been with us for years. On January 21, 2014, a meeting was held to explain the decision to our resident artists and to share community resources that will help with the transition. Throughout the next few weeks, the CAC administration and board members will be actively assisting our residents find new housing arrangements and maintaining studio space at the CAC.

Many things will stay the same at the CAC. This will not affect our studio artists and the Lois M. Nelson Theater will remain available for productions, concerts and ceremonies. CAC will still be home to Children’s Theatre Workshop, Northwest Ohio Community Shares, and the Toledo Pride 419 community center.

Still, this transformation is the first step in an overall strategy to ensure that CAC remains an integral part of the Toledo community. Moving forward, the CAC plans to offer art-based programming and create new public spaces for community engagement and creativity. CAC will also be embarking on a capital campaign to restore and maintain our historic building.

We look forward to continuing to work with our local artists and community members to make the CAC a space that benefits the entire community. We’re planning great things in the future and hope that you will be a part of it."

created by anonymouscoward on Jan 21, 2014 at 11:13:36 pm     Site-related     Comments: 121

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Comments ... #

Overall I think this is a negative situation. The residents helped keep the place busy and vibrant, while the low rent meant that artists could have affordable housing while working full-time on art.

The sense of community that the CAC fostered will be significantly affected by this decision.

Of course, that is a mammoth structure that has had HVAC, plumbing, roof, and electrical issues for a long time, so I suppose this is not a surprise. I remember interviewing the CAC director around 2005 and at that time he estimated the place needed a half million in renovations (if memory serves me correctly) just to fix the roof, the parking lot, and some major plumbing/electrical issues.

Sad.

posted by historymike on Jan 21, 2014 at 11:32:18 pm     #   1 person liked this

I think situations like this highlight the issue of reality vs. the Bohemian lifestyle. Although artists (in the general sense of the word) may want to spend their days and nights painting, composing, writing poetry, etc., realistically they need to earn enough money to eat, pay rent, etc.

If they can relate making a living with their talent by performing, selling their art, teaching their art, etc., that's great. The other option is to find a sponsor, which in some respect is what the CAC was doing by offering affordable rent; but people with the money and willingness to spend it that way are difficult to come by.

posted by Starr15 on Jan 21, 2014 at 11:57:52 pm     #   2 people liked this

This was mentioned at the OWE Association meeting last night. Sounds like everyone is finding out about this at once.

Things I'm hearing from a variety of sources include:

"pipes froze, heating is a major problem, tenants have not been punctual about paying rent, some residents have been doing damage to the building" etc

Also I've been told that at the meeting last night, everyone was given information on low income / affordable housing in the city.

Of course this doesn't lessen the impact on everyone / the community but the fact is the CAC has been broke for a long time. It's a massive building and needs some serious TLC.

posted by upso on Jan 22, 2014 at 11:47:50 am     #   1 person liked this

upso posted at 10:47:50 AM on Jan 22, 2014:

This was mentioned at the OWE Association meeting last night. Sounds like everyone is finding out about this at once.

Things I'm hearing from a variety of sources include:

"pipes froze, heating is a major problem, tenants have not been punctual about paying rent, some residents have been doing damage to the building" etc

Also I've been told that at the meeting last night, everyone was given information on low income / affordable housing in the city.

Of course this doesn't lessen the impact on everyone / the community but the fact is the CAC has been broke for a long time. It's a massive building and needs some serious TLC.

Gotta love how they booted out everyone in the middle of winter, though. Really brilliant move there. Shows all kinds of caring and concern.

I think the residents should look up the directors and egg and TP their housesspontaneously artistically redecorate the exterior of their domiciles using natural green recyclable and biodegradable materials.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 22, 2014 at 12:01:29 pm     #   2 people liked this

I agree, the timing is pretty awful.

posted by upso on Jan 22, 2014 at 12:19:02 pm     #  

People must have a lot of inside information to assign intent with the timing in such a way as to suggest retaliation against those who quite probably made a heart-wrenchingly difficult, yet right decision.

Sometimes things just suck without any evil intent.

News flash: poverty, both personally and organizationally, is sometimes accompanied by inconvenience.

posted by justread on Jan 22, 2014 at 01:03:46 pm     #   6 people liked this

Alternate thread title based on actual statement:

Collingwood Arts Center arrives at extremely difficult decision to end residency, understands impact on 28 residents and vows to actively assist them.

posted by justread on Jan 22, 2014 at 01:08:13 pm     #   4 people liked this

Right on, justread! I see some similarities between the position of the CAC and the administration of the botanical garden. An administrator made a decision in the past to reduce the presence and importance of the resident arts/crafts groups who occupy cottages on the grounds. Same issues, same outcry, same hurt feelings. It's great to have synergy among artistic people and allied institutions, but as justread says, poverty (or extremely constrained budgets) can lead to inconvenience for everyone involved.

posted by viola on Jan 22, 2014 at 02:36:53 pm     #  

justread posted at 12:03:46 PM on Jan 22, 2014:

People must have a lot of inside information to assign intent with the timing in such a way as to suggest retaliation against those who quite probably made a heart-wrenchingly difficult, yet right decision.

Sometimes things just suck without any evil intent.

News flash: poverty, both personally and organizationally, is sometimes accompanied by inconvenience.

I do have some inside info. Feel free to apologize for being an ass anytime now.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 22, 2014 at 02:48:50 pm     #  

can you share the inside info?

posted by upso on Jan 22, 2014 at 02:54:22 pm     #  

upso posted at 11:19:02 AM on Jan 22, 2014:

I agree, the timing is pretty awful.

I didn't see a deadline for moving out - yes, it was announced during a frigid cold but maybe they are giving people a few months to make the transition. I read the article several times and didn't see a date for moving. Did I miss something?

posted by MrsArcher on Jan 22, 2014 at 03:00:12 pm     #  

I believe they were given 30 days

posted by upso on Jan 22, 2014 at 03:14:12 pm     #  

Not now...but in the dead of winter....when its colder...

posted by Molsonator on Jan 22, 2014 at 03:19:29 pm     #   1 person liked this

Back in early 1974 I had just returned from military service and was working 2-3 jobs to survive. I landed a job working contract security as chief of security for Mary Manse college. Back then the building was still a convent. I frequently worked the midnight shift and as part of my grounds patrol had to go into the convent and check security in the building. Quite daunting for a Catholic boy who still had a healthy respect and fear of nuns. The building was beautiful but in really bad condition even back then. There were problems with the roof and plumbing and mice frequently ran through the halls. It was really spooky at 1am in the morning. I am actually surprised it has been occupied this long.

posted by Wydowmaker on Jan 22, 2014 at 04:11:01 pm     #  

anonymouscoward posted at 01:48:50 PM on Jan 22, 2014:
justread posted at 12:03:46 PM on Jan 22, 2014:

People must have a lot of inside information to assign intent with the timing in such a way as to suggest retaliation against those who quite probably made a heart-wrenchingly difficult, yet right decision.

Sometimes things just suck without any evil intent.

News flash: poverty, both personally and organizationally, is sometimes accompanied by inconvenience.

I do have some inside info. Feel free to apologize for being an ass anytime now.

Share your anti-CAC leadership agenda, Cupcake.

posted by justread on Jan 22, 2014 at 04:18:46 pm     #   1 person liked this

justread posted at 03:18:46 PM on Jan 22, 2014:
anonymouscoward posted at 01:48:50 PM on Jan 22, 2014:
justread posted at 12:03:46 PM on Jan 22, 2014:

People must have a lot of inside information to assign intent with the timing in such a way as to suggest retaliation against those who quite probably made a heart-wrenchingly difficult, yet right decision.

Sometimes things just suck without any evil intent.

News flash: poverty, both personally and organizationally, is sometimes accompanied by inconvenience.

I do have some inside info. Feel free to apologize for being an ass anytime now.

Share your anti-CAC leadership agenda, Cupcake.

I don't have an agenda, and I couldn't share any specifics because frankly I think you would love to use anything I say to pull a Blade-vs-EconCat hit on me and therefore will not give you anything, Buckwheat. Though I do find your immediate defense of and white-knighting for the CAC admin very suspicious and interesting. "The gentleman doth protest too much, methinks."

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 22, 2014 at 04:45:35 pm     #   1 person liked this

anonymouscoward posted at 03:45:35 PM on Jan 22, 2014:
justread posted at 03:18:46 PM on Jan 22, 2014:
anonymouscoward posted at 01:48:50 PM on Jan 22, 2014:
justread posted at 12:03:46 PM on Jan 22, 2014:

People must have a lot of inside information to assign intent with the timing in such a way as to suggest retaliation against those who quite probably made a heart-wrenchingly difficult, yet right decision.

Sometimes things just suck without any evil intent.

News flash: poverty, both personally and organizationally, is sometimes accompanied by inconvenience.

I do have some inside info. Feel free to apologize for being an ass anytime now.

Share your anti-CAC leadership agenda, Cupcake.

I don't have an agenda, and I couldn't share any specifics because frankly I think you would love to use anything I say to pull a Blade-vs-EconCat hit on me and therefore will not give you anything, Buckwheat. Though I do find your immediate defense of and white-knighting for the CAC admin very suspicious and interesting. "The gentleman doth protest too much, methinks."

My reasoned reply providing balance to your suggestion that people egg and TP people's houses is a clear sign that I am guilty of something evil.

That's rational.

posted by justread on Jan 22, 2014 at 04:53:51 pm     #   3 people liked this

justread posted at 03:53:51 PM on Jan 22, 2014:
anonymouscoward posted at 03:45:35 PM on Jan 22, 2014:
justread posted at 03:18:46 PM on Jan 22, 2014:
anonymouscoward posted at 01:48:50 PM on Jan 22, 2014:
justread posted at 12:03:46 PM on Jan 22, 2014:

People must have a lot of inside information to assign intent with the timing in such a way as to suggest retaliation against those who quite probably made a heart-wrenchingly difficult, yet right decision.

Sometimes things just suck without any evil intent.

News flash: poverty, both personally and organizationally, is sometimes accompanied by inconvenience.

I do have some inside info. Feel free to apologize for being an ass anytime now.

Share your anti-CAC leadership agenda, Cupcake.

I don't have an agenda, and I couldn't share any specifics because frankly I think you would love to use anything I say to pull a Blade-vs-EconCat hit on me and therefore will not give you anything, Buckwheat. Though I do find your immediate defense of and white-knighting for the CAC admin very suspicious and interesting. "The gentleman doth protest too much, methinks."

My reasoned reply providing balance to your suggestion that people egg and TP people's houses is a clear sign that I am guilty of something evil.

That's rational.

Whatevs, Sparky. The word I heard around town sounded like they started taking down furnishings and fixtures and giving the bum rush to residents immediately after the meeting, and that this whole mess pretty much blindsided the residents. Also heard that the media was off interviewing the residents and things will get interesting after that hits the news. But, again, whatevs, you gotta defend your peeps.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 22, 2014 at 05:22:24 pm     #  

Don't know if this falls under the category of bum's rush but they were given until Feb. 28th. Many could find space in The Secor, there are also spaces downtown above a gallery near The Blarney (name escapes me), isn't there also space on St. Clair right across from Farmers Market?

posted by fred on Jan 22, 2014 at 09:59:38 pm     #  

Sure, but the CAC was only charging 75-100 a month in rent for the residents. Pretty much impossible to find something similar ANYwhere. You aren't going to find apartments for $100 a month except in the dodgiest of locations. Same for studio space... they were the cheapest in town by a long shot.

It's one of many reasons the CAC wasn't doing well. They weren't charging anywhere near what they should have been charging.

posted by upso on Jan 22, 2014 at 10:24:25 pm     #   4 people liked this

upso posted at 09:24:25 PM on Jan 22, 2014:

Sure, but the CAC was only charging 75-100 a month in rent for the residents. Pretty much impossible to find something similar ANYwhere. You aren't going to find apartments for $100 a month except in the dodgiest of locations. Same for studio space... they were the cheapest in town by a long shot.

It's one of many reasons the CAC wasn't doing well. They weren't charging anywhere near what they should have been charging.

Admittedly. Then again questions are being raised as to where was all the money going....

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 22, 2014 at 10:36:13 pm     #  

Hopefully those will be answered when Sarah speaks with me next Thursday on air. Until then let the anonymous speculation without facts continue.

posted by fred on Jan 22, 2014 at 10:50:02 pm     #   2 people liked this

fred posted at 09:50:02 PM on Jan 22, 2014:

Hopefully those will be answered when Sarah speaks with me next Thursday on air. Until then let the anonymous speculation without facts continue.

Interviewing any residents?

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 22, 2014 at 10:55:37 pm     #   1 person liked this

anonymouscoward posted at 09:36:13 PM on Jan 22, 2014:
upso posted at 09:24:25 PM on Jan 22, 2014:

Sure, but the CAC was only charging 75-100 a month in rent for the residents. Pretty much impossible to find something similar ANYwhere. You aren't going to find apartments for $100 a month except in the dodgiest of locations. Same for studio space... they were the cheapest in town by a long shot.

It's one of many reasons the CAC wasn't doing well. They weren't charging anywhere near what they should have been charging.

Admittedly. Then again questions are being raised as to where was all the money going....

"all the money" can't be much of anything. i have ZERO involvement over at the CAC other than being a neighbor... so this is just me being speculative...

but if you double what people are paying in rent to live there, you get less than 6 grand a month. reality is more like 3-4k a month if everyone pays on time.

That building is easily over 100 thousand square feet of space that needs to be heated. No idea what rent or mortgage is, but in general there is NO way they are pulling in enough money to just pay their basic needs / bills.

That said, not really sure what kicking out their paying residents will do to HELP their bottom line. Long story short, I really hope they can figure this all out and that the artists involved can find positive & safe places to relocate!

posted by upso on Jan 22, 2014 at 11:07:55 pm     #   1 person liked this

"... Sarah speaks with me next Thursday ..."

I assume that's tomorrow, Thu, Jan 23, since today is still Wednesday in the eastern time zone, and tomorrow is the next Thursday, according to my Vincent van Gogh wall calendar.

"Until then let the anonymous speculation without facts continue."

I'm so damn thankful that the media gives us permission to act like them.

posted by jr on Jan 22, 2014 at 11:10:07 pm     #   8 people liked this

jr posted at 10:10:07 PM on Jan 22, 2014:

"... Sarah speaks with me next Thursday ..."

I assume that's tomorrow, Thu, Jan 23, since today is still Wednesday in the eastern time zone, and tomorrow is the next Thursday, according to my Vincent van Gogh wall calendar.

"Until then let the anonymous speculation without facts continue."

I'm so damn thankful that the media gives us permission to act like them.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 22, 2014 at 11:28:23 pm     #   2 people liked this

The park hotel years ago provided low cost marginal housing for many who couldnt afford anything else and the city condemned the place. I dont think cac should get a pass if it isnt up to standards. They also owe a bundle of unpaid property taxes the low billed amount they have.

posted by EconCat88 on Jan 22, 2014 at 11:39:23 pm     #   1 person liked this

That was pretty funny Jr and it only took you 20 minutes to come up with it. No, next Thursday as most people understand it would mean next Thursday the 30th, If I'd meant Thursday the 23rd I would have said tomorrow since I posted so late. If any residents wish to call in and complain that they can't make it on their own, or that money was mispent they will certainly get on air.

posted by fred on Jan 23, 2014 at 06:17:09 am     #   1 person liked this

fred posted at 09:50:02 PM on Jan 22, 2014:

Hopefully those will be answered when Sarah speaks with me next Thursday on air. Until then let the anonymous speculation without facts continue.

I think that the organization was actually founded as part of an elaborate scheme to lure artists into a false sense of security and then strip the wealthy artists of their money and leave them broke and homeless, with no options and no ability to go forward in life in any other way. Maybe even to hurt their feelings.

It's the only scenario that makes any sense.

posted by justread on Jan 23, 2014 at 07:12:55 am     #   2 people liked this

fred posted at 05:17:09 AM on Jan 23, 2014:

That was pretty funny Jr and it only took you 20 minutes to come up with it. No, next Thursday as most people understand it would mean next Thursday the 30th, If I'd meant Thursday the 23rd I would have said tomorrow since I posted so late. If any residents wish to call in and complain that they can't make it on their own, or that money was mispent they will certainly get on air.

Wow, so you're going to be unfairly unbalanced in who you actually bring into the studio and just let this flap out here so you can say "hey, the other side had a chance to call in..." should anyone point out the bias and lack of opposing viewpoints.

I am IMPRESSED. And +1 point for "complain that they can't make it on their own" too.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 09:33:45 am     #   1 person liked this

not being unfair at all. sarah is the name out front in all this so I contacted her. if you care to name one of the aggrieved artists and give me contact info I'll contact them too. otherwise the phones are open for three hours each morning. no calls today though, so perhaps the story isn't nearly as interesting as you think. but the offer is there if you want to take advantage of it and intro me to your starving artist friends.

posted by fred on Jan 23, 2014 at 10:02:38 am     #   1 person liked this

Anyone who knows a little about landlord-tenant law knows that a 30 day notice is the beginning of the process, and often far from the end. It would seem highly unlikely anyone will be forced out into the cold in 30 days -- heat and humidity are more likely to be an issue come moving day.

posted by bam2 on Jan 23, 2014 at 10:12:46 am     #  

bam2 posted at 09:12:46 AM on Jan 23, 2014:

Anyone who knows a little about landlord-tenant law knows that a 30 day notice is the beginning of the process, and often far from the end. It would seem highly unlikely anyone will be forced out into the cold in 30 days -- heat and humidity are more likely to be an issue come moving day.

Oh but they were all violating their leases by having space heaters, so they can be booted much sooner!

Then again it'll get UGLY if anyone fights back citing the lack of functioning heat....

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 10:59:45 am     #  

You keep saying that, but where are they, who are they? So far the only ugly thing is the repetition that there's something nefarious going on behind the scenes. Shit or get off the pot.

posted by fred on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:06:52 am     #   3 people liked this

fred posted at 09:02:38 AM on Jan 23, 2014:

not being unfair at all. sarah is the name out front in all this so I contacted her. if you care to name one of the aggrieved artists and give me contact info I'll contact them too. otherwise the phones are open for three hours each morning. no calls today though, so perhaps the story isn't nearly as interesting as you think. but the offer is there if you want to take advantage of it and intro me to your starving artist friends.

So you can take the initiative to contact Sarah but not to wander your ass down to the CAC and talk to the residents. They should contact YOU, or have an intermediary go to YOU.

Man that's some goddamn fine journalism and investigation from our great media. Clearly they are unbiased. Truly, the only reason only one side is ever presented is that there is no other side worth bringing up, since it's their responsibility to psychically know when the media is going to present something and to demand equal time.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:15:16 am     #   1 person liked this

https://www.facebook.com/CollingwoodArtsCenter/posts/659051924133751

A Follow-up Note from Sarah Kurfis, Executive Director, Collingwood Arts Center:

This is a follow up note to address the concerns expressed about the 30 day notice and give more details about the issues that make the Collingwood Arts Center (CAC) building unsuitable for full-time residents, but will still allow for studio, office space and event use.

We decided on a 30 day notice for three primary reasons. The first is simple - everyone here is on a month-to-month lease. Second, we are unable to continue to pay the overhead that goes with rental usage for a period longer than 30 days. The CAC is currently owed over $10,000 in unpaid rent from our current residents. It is sad, but we are unable to continue to assist people that are unable to pay rent as we have in the past. The CAC’s mission was never assist residents financially beyond low rental prices. However, over the years due to high staff and board turnover, we have drifted off course. We do not have the expertise or resources of a social services agency to give the aid that is needed. Finally, the facility’s issues are potentially severe enough that, if things worsen, all residents would have to leave with little or no notice.

Our building has significant heating, electrical, and plumbing issues. The facility is heated with hot water boilers. While we possess three boilers to heat our residential areas, only two are currently functioning. With one boiler not working, we cannot keep comfortable temperatures this winter – the building ranges from cold to very cold. Our plan is that once the upper floors are vacated, we can insulate the radiators and thus keep more heat in the system. This will keep the lower floors warmer and suitable for studio or office space while we raise the funds to remedy the problem.

Adding to the heating problems, are issues with electricity. The entire CAC facility has approximately 200 amps of electric service entering the building. Additionally, the residential portions of the building have not been significantly upgraded since 1906 and do no support modern appliances and computers. On average, three residential rooms are on one 15 amp fuse. This not an ideal situation at any time, but this winter it is especially problematic. Residents feel the need to run space heaters to stay warm which taxes the system, blows fuses and leaves residents without electricity. This also creates potential fire hazards. Studio, office space and event rentals will not require such continuous use on the system.

Just like much of the electricity, the CAC’s plumbing is original to the building. A few months ago, a sewer pipe failed. This forced us to close one of our four residential bathrooms. Leaving three bathrooms for approximately 30 residents to share. This puts additional strain on the aging restroom and shower facilities. Further, when the severe weather hit we had two water pipes burst. This created significant general damage to the building, but also knocked out the water heater that serviced the building. As a result, we are using a residential-grade electric water heater. This is not enough hot water for all the residents in a building. Another hard freeze could further and likely will damage the 100 year-old pipes to the extent where water to the residential part of the building would have to be shut off. Our current financial situation will not allow us to quickly remedy the remedy the situation.

We understand that giving a 30 day notice to long-term residents is not the ideal situation. We knew that this would be not a popular decision within the community. However, as a landlord we are currently unable to guarantee a safe, comfortable living experience for our residents. Our building is 108 years old and not getting any younger. We need to drastically lighten the usage of the building to extend its life. Hopefully, this will give us more time to restore and repair. Time is especially important given the limited financial resources.

Our efforts now have to be directed at saving the building while still maintaining an arts center for the community. We’re saddened at the loss of our residents and the life, joy and art that they brought to the facility. However, our old business model was failing. The CAC simply does not have the capacity to continue forward on the same path. Our path forward is uncertain, but success is now an option.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:18:37 am     #  

"The center’s board president, Toledo attorney Mike Bell, did not return phone calls to his office." -- The Blade

Hey Freddie, why not see if you can score one on The Blah and get HIM on the air?

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:25:09 am     #  

It's not Fred's fucking fault that the place is a dump or that they decided to close it up instead of investing a few hundred thousand dollars into it to make it habitable. I don't see their decision as being malicious at all.

It's entirely possible that the residents are keenly aware that there are no sensible and logical arguments that will support a position contrary to the decision to close the residency program at the facility.

Fred - why not invite AC down to speak on behalf of the residents who so far have chosen not to represent their own interest. I suggest though that you keep a finger on the bleep button because AC seems wound up.

posted by jimavolt on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:31:46 am     #   5 people liked this

So, just a question.

Is their mission "arts" or is their mission to be a homeless shelter or to provide free housing?

posted by justread on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:32:59 am     #   3 people liked this

I notice you still haven't named one person yet who you personally know who is willing to step forward. It makes me think you are just blowing smoke out your ass on this one. Won't need Bell since I have the point person Sarah. And it is not my job to track down residents or "wander my ass" anywhere. I'm not a journalist, you are thinking of the Blade writers.Not sure about the psychic part since not only is it being talked about here, it's also being talked about on my show, so no psychic powers needed. Now if there are any residents on here reading this and you wish to talk about your plight e mail me at fred@wspd.com and I'll set up an on air interview, or call the show when Sarah is on at 419-240-1370. Now anoncoward can calm down.

posted by fred on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:35:56 am     #  

jimavolt posted at 10:31:46 AM on Jan 23, 2014:

It's not Fred's fucking fault that the place is a dump or that they decided to close it up instead of investing a few hundred thousand dollars into it to make it habitable. I don't see their decision as being malicious at all.

It's entirely possible that the residents are keenly aware that there are no sensible and logical arguments that will support a position contrary to the decision to close the residency program at the facility.

Fred - why not invite AC down to speak on behalf of the residents who so far have chosen not to represent their own interest. I suggest though that you keep a finger on the bleep button because AC seems wound up.

There's a restraining order against me being within 500 feet of WSPD at all times. I have to avoid Oregon Road north of Owens because of it.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:36:12 am     #  

If I pass out brushes and charcoal pencils at Cherry Street Mission, is it technically an "artists colony?"

posted by justread on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:39:34 am     #   1 person liked this

I'm sorry, Fred old chap, but I'm not coming on down or phoning in.

But here's some questions to toss out there:

How the heck did they manage to get $10k behind on rent?

How have they been running for what? 15 years?!?! on a 200 amp electrical service? Come on now, really?

If everything has been in such dire straits, where was the big "PLEASE HELP US" fundraising campaign? No big CAC art sale with a "hey our boiler's not working, PLEASE BUY SOME ART TO KEEP US FROM KICKING EVERYONE OUT" message? You know, some actual big public try to avoid this instead of "OKAY EVERYONE OUT NOW!"? Cause, you know, if it's the Cherry Street Mission's freezer failing or boiler giving up the ghost, we hear about it on the news! Problems at the CAC? Nary a peep from our esteemed media, until they can't ignore the story!

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 12:00:24 pm     #   1 person liked this

justread posted at 10:39:34 AM on Jan 23, 2014:

If I pass out brushes and charcoal pencils at Cherry Street Mission, is it technically an "artists colony?"

Compassionate conservatism, ladies and gentlemen.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 12:03:12 pm     #  

justread posted at 10:32:59 AM on Jan 23, 2014:

So, just a question.

Is their mission "arts" or is their mission to be a homeless shelter or to provide free housing?

Feel free to take up Freddie's fine offer and call into his show and ask that question, if you have the brass balls to do it, Sunshine.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 12:04:46 pm     #   2 people liked this

anonymouscoward posted at 11:04:46 AM on Jan 23, 2014:
justread posted at 10:32:59 AM on Jan 23, 2014:

So, just a question.

Is their mission "arts" or is their mission to be a homeless shelter or to provide free housing?

Feel free to take up Freddie's fine offer and call into his show and ask that question, if you have the brass balls to do it, Sunshine.

Mission drift is a significant issue for organizations. It's a legitimate question which requires no special brass equipment to ask.
Organizations often get caught up in issues or expenses that are not central to their primary mission. They end up in circumstances in which they have to decide whether to let the side issues kill them, or focus on the primary mission.

I believe that Lois Nelson et al. were interested in promoting art as a cultural value, not supporting artists as a social welfare program. The social welfare program seemed to develop along the way, and obviously must be restructured for the primary mission elements to survive.

Companies sometimes have to ask themselves the hard question: is our mission providing employment, or do we provide employment to deliver our mission?

These circumstances tend to bring forward the voices of true leaders and the voices of underinformed rabble rousers and agitators. Guess which one you are, cupcake?

posted by justread on Jan 23, 2014 at 12:20:52 pm     #   4 people liked this

justread posted at 11:20:52 AM on Jan 23, 2014:
anonymouscoward posted at 11:04:46 AM on Jan 23, 2014:
justread posted at 10:32:59 AM on Jan 23, 2014:

So, just a question.

Is their mission "arts" or is their mission to be a homeless shelter or to provide free housing?

Feel free to take up Freddie's fine offer and call into his show and ask that question, if you have the brass balls to do it, Sunshine.

Mission drift is a significant issue for organizations. It's a legitimate question which requires no special brass equipment to ask.
Organizations often get caught up in issues or expenses that are not central to their primary mission. They end up in circumstances in which they have to decide whether to let the side issues kill them, or focus on the primary mission.

I believe that Lois Nelson et al. were interested in promoting art as a cultural value, not supporting artists as a social welfare program. The social welfare program seemed to develop along the way, and obviously must be restructured for the primary mission elements to survive.

Companies sometimes have to ask themselves the hard question: is our mission providing employment, or do we provide employment to deliver our mission?

These circumstances tend to bring forward the voices of true leaders and the voices of underinformed rabble rousers and agitators. Guess which one you are, cupcake?

BEHOLD JUSTREAD IN ALL HIS WHITE KNIGHTING GLORY

Okay, so how many Executive Directors has the CAC had?

http://www.toledocitypaper.com/December-issue-2-2012/A-challenging-road-ahead/

What are we at, 6 or 7 since 2002? Jesus Christ, who the hell does the CAC think they are, the Cleveland Browns?!

The leadership of Toledo’s not-for-profit artist’s residence, the Collingwood Arts Center, passed to attorney Mary Sawers on October 5 [2012].

[...]

High on the her priority list are finances and funding. Sawers has already arranged lower monthly payments with most of the CAC’s many creditors. The structure is old, and in need of serious repair, including roofing, electrical and plumbing. “We have a building that was built in 1906 that is the equivalent of a 32-bedroom home. The order of nuns for whom the place was built could not have anticipated the Internet, or the electrical gizmos we have.”

For the Collingwood Arts Center to survive, however, it needs to generate more revenue.

When did Sarah take over?

Ya see, Sparky, sometimes the public has to ask the corporations and nonprofits and government the hard question: what kind of f'ed up management is going on that these things are happening and nothing is getting done. I don't care if it's the Cleveland Browns or the CAC, when the turnover is like that and the problems ain't getting fixed the question is not "what is our mission?" but "who the hell is in charge of this trainwreck and how do we all go about getting the cars back on track?"

Who all is on the CAC board, how long have they been there, and what the hell have they been doing all this time?

If Sarah's trying to actually DO SOMETHING, then good for her, I'll wish her well of it, but I however think her implementation sucks, not least from a PR perspective, so far.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1350&dat=19920722&id=EA8wAAAAIBAJ&sjid=TwMEAAAAIBAJ&pg=4430,5903194 1992 grant for roof repair
http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1350&dat=20021022&id=TV1PAAAAIBAJ&sjid=AgQEAAAAIBAJ&pg=5999,2052829 2002 grant for roof repair
http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1350&dat=19870922&id=Pp1PAAAAIBAJ&sjid=6QIEAAAAIBAJ&pg=3164,3967780 $45/mo rents in 1987

Let's also dial this back

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1350&dat=19880925&id=A3BRAAAAIBAJ&sjid=zw0EAAAAIBAJ&pg=5445,1900454

1988. "There are whole floors that need to be rewired." "total project cost less than $500,000" "the project has turned the corner"

So tell me, what's been going on over at the CAC?

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 02:01:10 pm     #  

http://www.toledoblade.com/Art/2014/01/23/Deep-freeze-puts-Collingwood-Arts-Center-residents-out-on-street.html

Really Tahree? They are "out on the street?" None of them made other arrangements? Don't they have 30 days (or more if needed)? If I drive by there, will I see them "out on the street?" Will there be a pile of belongings and a dirty couch next to the curb?

Sensational biased journalism.

posted by justread on Jan 23, 2014 at 02:05:28 pm     #  

You cannot claim "mission creep" when they were residential/renting out in 1987, dear sweet UNREAD.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 02:06:04 pm     #  

anonymouscoward posted at 01:01:10 PM on Jan 23, 2014:
justread posted at 11:20:52 AM on Jan 23, 2014:
anonymouscoward posted at 11:04:46 AM on Jan 23, 2014:
justread posted at 10:32:59 AM on Jan 23, 2014:

So, just a question.

Is their mission "arts" or is their mission to be a homeless shelter or to provide free housing?

Feel free to take up Freddie's fine offer and call into his show and ask that question, if you have the brass balls to do it, Sunshine.

Mission drift is a significant issue for organizations. It's a legitimate question which requires no special brass equipment to ask.
Organizations often get caught up in issues or expenses that are not central to their primary mission. They end up in circumstances in which they have to decide whether to let the side issues kill them, or focus on the primary mission.

I believe that Lois Nelson et al. were interested in promoting art as a cultural value, not supporting artists as a social welfare program. The social welfare program seemed to develop along the way, and obviously must be restructured for the primary mission elements to survive.

Companies sometimes have to ask themselves the hard question: is our mission providing employment, or do we provide employment to deliver our mission?

These circumstances tend to bring forward the voices of true leaders and the voices of underinformed rabble rousers and agitators. Guess which one you are, cupcake?

BEHOLD JUSTREAD IN ALL HIS WHITE KNIGHTING GLORY

Okay, so how many Executive Directors has the CAC had?

http://www.toledocitypaper.com/December-issue-2-2012/A-challenging-road-ahead/

What are we at, 6 or 7 since 2002? Jesus Christ, who the hell does the CAC think they are, the Cleveland Browns?!

The leadership of Toledo’s not-for-profit artist’s residence, the Collingwood Arts Center, passed to attorney Mary Sawers on October 5 [2012].

[...]

High on the her priority list are finances and funding. Sawers has already arranged lower monthly payments with most of the CAC’s many creditors. The structure is old, and in need of serious repair, including roofing, electrical and plumbing. “We have a building that was built in 1906 that is the equivalent of a 32-bedroom home. The order of nuns for whom the place was built could not have anticipated the Internet, or the electrical gizmos we have.”

For the Collingwood Arts Center to survive, however, it needs to generate more revenue.

When did Sarah take over?

Ya see, Sparky, sometimes the public has to ask the corporations and nonprofits and government the hard question: what kind of f'ed up management is going on that these things are happening and nothing is getting done. I don't care if it's the Cleveland Browns or the CAC, when the turnover is like that and the problems ain't getting fixed the question is not "what is our mission?" but "who the hell is in charge of this trainwreck and how do we all go about getting the cars back on track?"

Who all is on the CAC board, how long have they been there, and what the hell have they been doing all this time?

If Sarah's trying to actually DO SOMETHING, then good for her, I'll wish her well of it, but I however think her implementation sucks, not least from a PR perspective, so far.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1350&dat=19920722&id=EA8wAAAAIBAJ&sjid=TwMEAAAAIBAJ&pg=4430,5903194 1992 grant for roof repair
http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1350&dat=20021022&id=TV1PAAAAIBAJ&sjid=AgQEAAAAIBAJ&pg=5999,2052829 2002 grant for roof repair

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1350&dat=19870922&id=Pp1PAAAAIBAJ&sjid=6QIEAAAAIBAJ&pg=3164,3967780 $45/mo rents in 1987

Let's also dial this back

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1350&dat=19880925&id=A3BRAAAAIBAJ&sjid=zw0EAAAAIBAJ&pg=5445,1900454

1988. "There are whole floors that need to be rewired." "total project cost less than $500,000" "the project has turned the corner"

So tell me, what's been going on over at the CAC?

Obviously a social welfare program, cupcake.

posted by justread on Jan 23, 2014 at 02:06:26 pm     #  

I remember now why Cupcake was on /p/robation.

posted by justread on Jan 23, 2014 at 02:07:45 pm     #   2 people liked this

"Fred - why not invite AC down to speak on behalf of the residents who so far have chosen not to represent their own interest. I suggest though that you keep a finger on the bleep button because AC seems wound up."

Why choose radio for discussions? That's like choosing a newspaper op-ed to host a discussion.

They are discussing here, in their own distinct styles, without the restrictions of some government entity and without the limitations of an old paradigm.

Web-based discussions are superior to radio discussions.

Radio is still be good for disseminating information, but for hosting discussions? That's a new one.

People can't call a commercial radio show at the callers' convenience, any time of the day and night, and get on the air. And people can't talk as long as they want without interruptions. But users can write whenever they want and in most cases, as much as they want on the Web.

But commercial radio, like WSPD, probably benefits some people.

Also based on the commercials that run on WSPD; Liberals wouldn’t make a good target audience. Not enough of us owe thousands to IRS; owe over $10K in credit card debt, over weight by 40lbs, have hormone issues or have a hard time “getting it up”. We’re also not good targets for endless “work from home schemes” and “invest in gold scams” ...

Commercial radio.

I'll even go out on a limb and say that the costs for WSPD or just Fred's show for one year exceeds the costs to fund this site for a year.

The Web. Disruptive. For discussions, simple-shit technology trumps bloated, archaic methods, and that fact hacks off many people in the media industry.

posted by jr on Jan 23, 2014 at 02:11:24 pm     #   5 people liked this

What's been going on is that artists, who will tell you they can't sell their work in Toledo, have been living quite cheaply in a building that requires extensive work. In order for the work to be done rents would have had to been raised years ago, and those unwilling or unable to pay should have been evicted. Instead the CAC let them stay, subsidized their rent to the detriment of the upkeep of the building. The public was not asked to invest in the CAC and most likely in this town wouldn't have anyway. How much have you donated to them coward?
You have a huge number of stories at your fingertips yet apparently only became interested when it hit the news otherwise it would have been here years ago. Your expectation that others would step forward to help doesn't seem to include yourself. Is that compassionate liberalism?
If these artists were half as good as many of them probably think they are they would be able to afford the rent and much better digs. Their stories are sad, but only in that one believes he can work at Jimmy John's and then create "art" all day and still support himself. It is a delusion perpetuated by liberals who believe as long as you are doing something you believe in, someone else should make sure you can continue.
Rather than belittle people on this site with cute nicknames and diminutive versions of their names why not show some courage instead of cowardice and step forward to help these folks with your money instead of words.

posted by fred on Jan 23, 2014 at 02:13:37 pm     #   3 people liked this

justread posted at 01:05:28 PM on Jan 23, 2014:

http://www.toledoblade.com/Art/2014/01/23/Deep-freeze-puts-Collingwood-Arts-Center-residents-out-on-street.html

Really Tahree? They are "out on the street?" None of them made other arrangements? Don't they have 30 days (or more if needed)? If I drive by there, will I see them "out on the street?" Will there be a pile of belongings and a dirty couch next to the curb?

Sensational biased journalism.

Yeah, and given I just pointed out the revolving door of leadership and the continual "oh we have issues with the building" despite the knowledge of all the issues from the start at the CAC, ya think the Strong Publisher™©® or someone else (HELLO TFP!) will do some actual investigation as to what the hell's been going on over there and why they're kicking everyone out now?

Let's see what theories come to mind. Feel free to combine them.

1) they're a bunch of dippy art people who can't plan their way out of a paper bag
2) CAC board and particularly the exec director office has a revolving door installed on it.
3) they suck at fundraising or getting the word out about their fundraising and needs
4) whatever money they have been getting hasn't been going into upgrades, or they haven't been able to stay ahead of problems (even though the electrical and heating have been known to be a problem from the start?!?)

There is a saying about how one should not attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity, but the line I have heard from sources tips the scales toward malice. Honestly, it'd be nice if that was truly wrong, but you know, it sort of takes deliberate action to get behind on rent collection, let the boiler fail, not make a big plea for help, and then use residents using space heaters to keep warm be an excuse to cite lease violation and boot them. Because if this was most any other non-profit in the area that had a major issue, they'd have a blurb on the news about their "crisis" and be soliciting donations. See also Cherry Street Mission news stories above.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 02:26:57 pm     #   1 person liked this

jr posted at 01:11:24 PM on Jan 23, 2014:

"Fred - why not invite AC down to speak on behalf of the residents who so far have chosen not to represent their own interest. I suggest though that you keep a finger on the bleep button because AC seems wound up."

Why choose radio for discussions? That's like choosing a newspaper op-ed to host a discussion.

They are discussing here, in their own distinct styles, without the restrictions of some government entity and without the limitations of an old paradigm.

Web-based discussions are superior to radio discussions.

Radio is still be good for disseminating information, but for hosting discussions? That's a new one.

People can't call a commercial radio show at the callers' convenience, any time of the day and night, and get on the air. And people can't talk as long as they want without interruptions. But users can write whenever they want and in most cases, as much as they want on the Web.

But commercial radio, like WSPD, probably benefits some people.

Also based on the commercials that run on WSPD; Liberals wouldn’t make a good target audience. Not enough of us owe thousands to IRS; owe over $10K in credit card debt, over weight by 40lbs, have hormone issues or have a hard time “getting it up”. We’re also not good targets for endless “work from home schemes” and “invest in gold scams” ...

Commercial radio.

I'll even go out on a limb and say that the costs for WSPD or just Fred's show for one year exceeds the costs to fund this site for a year.

The Web. Disruptive. For discussions, simple-shit technology trumps bloated, archaic methods, and that fact hacks off many people in the media industry.

GODDAMN STRAIGHT JR

HIGH FIVE DUDE

ahem.

TV and radio are outlets where the host gets to present their case and they get to have all their own selectively-edited sound bites and video clips queued up and ready to fire off as if to back up any biased point they want to make. And yes this does apply to "both sides". All due respect to Fred, he and his dudes are the ones with their finger on the button, they can cut the interviews short, disconnect the callers and claim "oops bad connection", whatever. Limbaugh, Beck, Bill O'RLY, Chris Matthews, Rev. Al Sharpton, they get to pick who they have on, they can talk all over their guests and not let them get a word in edgewise, and most people have zero clues about rhetorical tactics and logical fallacies and all that so they don't spot what's going on on these shows and realize that "fair and balanced" is complete bullshit.

Print journalism is the same way. The Blah can go spend several days stalking EconCat and portraying him to be Satan incarnate or whatever, but he doesn't get a free half page to rebut whatever the Blah writes about him. If he actually wanted to do that, he'd have to pay The Blah (or someone else), assuming they'd actually take his money in the first place.

This is the Internets, and the only way to control the narrative is to control the tubes making up the Internets (oh noes I crossed the threads again, see also the Net Neutrality thread) and block access to anything you don't like (Great Firewall of China-style), and good luck doing that as "The Net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it." -- http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/John_Gilmore (oh see what I did there, I cited the source of a quote!)

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 02:45:40 pm     #  

Their stories are sad, but only in that one believes he can work at Jimmy John's and then create "art" all day and still support himself.

But fred, people who work at Jimmy John's live in apartments. These poor Picassos are on the street.

posted by justread on Jan 23, 2014 at 03:06:31 pm     #  

Maybe Sally Struthers can do a commercial and plead for you to donate just .25 cents a day to house and support your local artist. In return, you will get a picture of the artist you are supporting.................cue the sympathy music

posted by Hoops on Jan 23, 2014 at 03:33:21 pm     #  

https://www.facebook.com/events/1376232059304758

I see a Nolan Rosenkranz is attending...

How about it Freddie and Sparky, you gonna show up?

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 03:34:42 pm     #  

What's been going on is that artists, who will tell you they can't sell their work in Toledo, have been living quite cheaply in a building that requires extensive work.

I don't know about "can't sell their work in Toledo". There's this thing called "The Internet" and it has these other things on it called "Etsy" and "Pinterest" and "eBay" and "DeviantArt" and so on for them to promote and sell stuff on.

The building's "required extensive work for years" and apparently was supposed to take all of $500k to do it in 1988. Residents back then were chipping in to get work done cheaper. Hell, don't we have some trade schools and whatnot around here who could maybe put some trainees to work fixing up the CAC?

In order for the work to be done rents would have had to been raised years ago, and those unwilling or unable to pay should have been evicted. Instead the CAC let them stay, subsidized their rent to the detriment of the upkeep of the building.

How about you, o great media figure, ask to see the books, since your almighty power and influence is greater than mine? They're not going to crack them open for a random AnonymousCoward, after all. And they certainly got grants to do work, so this is why I'm wondering who was doing what when and where did the money go, was it spent wisely, what's up with the fundraising, why can I hit Google and find big pleas to help the CSM but not the CAC, etc. I agree on going after the deadbeats, but that again is a management problem. Just like the threads here concerning all the delinquent property taxes, where's the enforcement and is it selective enforcement and whatever other questions come up.

Please ask Sarah how many "subsidized rents" there were and how much, to back your claim up.

The public was not asked to invest in the CAC and most likely in this town wouldn't have anyway.

The CAC apparently has like 2 fundraisers every year, which I only found out about by hitting the Googles. But Our Glorious Media is more than happy to tell us about the annual United Way kickoff, the annual Salvation Army Red Kettle drive, and the Girl Scout Cookie Drive. Hmmmmmmmmm.

How much have you donated to them coward? You have a huge number of stories at your fingertips yet apparently only became interested when it hit the news otherwise it would have been here years ago.

How much I may or may not have donated directly to the CAC or any events there or directly or indirectly have done to/for their residents is something I choose to keep private. As for not posting everything I hear about here, that's also my prerogative. There's a saying about "Strike while the iron is hot".

Your expectation that others would step forward to help doesn't seem to include yourself. Is that compassionate liberalism?

Oh look, I got Fred to say the L-word.

If these artists were half as good as many of them probably think they are they would be able to afford the rent and much better digs. Their stories are sad, but only in that one believes he can work at Jimmy John's and then create "art" all day and still support himself.

Not everyone can be Banksy. I've known a lot of "art people", some of them are smart, some of them are dumber than rocks, some of them are motivated, some are lazy, and a lot of them are, to put it in a word, mental. But that's bias on my part because personally I never got any artistic genetics. It's my opinion that the better artists are mentally messed up (manic-depressive/bipolar) and those sort of people find it hard to hold down jobs. If you throw them on meds to control that, so they can hold down a job, it takes away something that makes them good artists (something I've personally witnessed). I'm not a big believer in, and I'll use the forbidden word, unlimited WELFARE, but they're making art instead of panhandling on street corners, and I'd rather help them than someone whose idea of work is to stand on a streetcorner with a sign.

Rather than belittle people on this site with cute nicknames and diminutive versions of their names why not show some courage instead of cowardice and step forward to help these folks with your money instead of words.

Sure thing, Freddie. Oh, and do be sure to pass along your words to your bud justread, particularly the bit about cute nicknames.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 03:55:07 pm     #   1 person liked this

I like the knight picture, Cupcake. :)

posted by justread on Jan 23, 2014 at 04:18:14 pm     #  

justread posted at 03:18:14 PM on Jan 23, 2014:

I like the knight picture, Cupcake. :)

Ah don' wanna talk to you no more, you empty-headed animal food-trough wiper! Ah fart in your general direction! Your mother was a hamster, and your father smelt of elderberries!

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 04:31:00 pm     #   2 people liked this

I wonder if people put a Z at the end of my name on purpose.

I'm not sure if I'll be able to make tonight's meeting (which I planned to go to as an OWE resident and not as a reporter) which would be a shame.

posted by Nolan_Rosenkrans on Jan 23, 2014 at 05:18:44 pm     #  

Nolan_Rosenkrans posted at 04:18:44 PM on Jan 23, 2014:

I wonder if people put a Z at the end of my name on purpose.

I'm not sure if I'll be able to make tonight's meeting (which I planned to go to as an OWE resident and not as a reporter) which would be a shame.

Sorry, CA is lysdexic sometiems.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 05:23:03 pm     #  

Probably just ignorance since your name is easy to spell and part of each post, that or laziness.

posted by fred on Jan 23, 2014 at 05:23:30 pm     #  

It happens all the time. Even my phone display at work has a Z, which is both infuriating and hilarious.

I think it more has to do with it sounding like there should be a Z, and because of Hamlet.

posted by Nolan_Rosenkrans on Jan 23, 2014 at 05:25:01 pm     #  

Nolan_Rosenkrans posted at 04:25:01 PM on Jan 23, 2014:

It happens all the time. Even my phone display at work has a Z, which is both infuriating and hilarious.

I think it more has to do with it sounding like there should be a Z, and because of Hamlet.

Cisco phones are a snap to reprogram from the call manager... poke your sysadmin.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 05:26:53 pm     #  

I prefer to just shake my fist at the display.

posted by Nolan_Rosenkrans on Jan 23, 2014 at 05:30:14 pm     #   1 person liked this

Nolan_Rosenkrans posted at 04:30:14 PM on Jan 23, 2014:

I prefer to just shake my fist at the display.

We have a guy named Guildenstein.
He does the same thing. :)

posted by justread on Jan 23, 2014 at 05:52:28 pm     #  

This is how I imagined Nolan when I read his shaking fist comment.

posted by hunkytownsausage on Jan 23, 2014 at 06:04:55 pm     #   3 people liked this

Ah! So Shakespeare is to blame when people leave the S off my last name, as Master Ford calls himself Master Brook when he disguises himself when meeting Falstaff in The Merry Wives of Windsor .

<pause>

Or people are just lazy. So sue me.

posted by historymike on Jan 23, 2014 at 06:06:58 pm     #  

historymike posted at 05:06:58 PM on Jan 23, 2014:

Ah! So Shakespeare is to blame when people leave the S off my last name, as Master Ford calls himself Master Brook when he disguises himself when meeting Falstaff in The Merry Wives of Windsor .

<pause>

Or people are just lazy. So sue me.

Don't ask me how many English professors have asked me where Guildenstern is.

/threadhijack

posted by Nolan_Rosenkrans on Jan 23, 2014 at 06:29:56 pm     #  

Only able to stay for a little more than an hour at the OWE Arts meeting tonight, but did get to hear the assets, obstacles, and opportunities discussion. Ran into Pete who is the oldest resident who will be losing his room. He's 72 and has been living there since the 80's. According to him he already has a place to stay within walking distance and will be just fine.
Others in attendance had some interesting takes on what the assets of the neighborhood are, what obstacles stand in their way, and especially their opportunities. Most of the opportunities involved grants and revenue streams.
One woman, wish I could remember her name, made a point I've made on air a number of times, and that is that Toledo suffers from Balkanization. She pointed out that too many groups just want to hold on to their turf and aren't interested in really working together despite the lip service. I'll have more info once Rachel sends out the expected e-mail. Seemed as though quite a few of those in attendance wanted to vent, and quite frankly that wasn't why the meeting was scheduled.

posted by fred on Jan 23, 2014 at 09:16:11 pm     #   4 people liked this

Holy fecal matter. Fred said something I agree with. Everything in the area is non-stop turf wars.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 10:53:20 pm     #  

I really don't care much about old houses that haven't been kept up and that shelter people who aren't decent enough to pay their rent.

What would interest me is to get the stories behind these "artists." Having been a professor at a university for 26 years, I learned that many of these types love to label themselves "artists" or "scholars." I found out that what most of us call "surfing the web" they called "research" and "scholars" were people who read lots of books about a particular subject.

I'm just wondering if this place housed a bunch of people who didn't have the label of "artists"--would people even be talking about it?

posted by Starr15 on Jan 23, 2014 at 10:57:42 pm     #   5 people liked this

Starr15 posted at 09:57:42 PM on Jan 23, 2014:

I really don't care much about old houses that haven't been kept up and that shelter people who aren't decent enough to pay their rent.

What would interest me is to get the stories behind these "artists." Having been a professor at a university for 26 years, I learned that many of these types love to label themselves "artists" or "scholars." I found out that what most of us call "surfing the web" they called "research" and "scholars" were people who read lots of books about a particular subject.

I'm just wondering if this place housed a bunch of people who didn't have the label of "artists"--would people even be talking about it?

Probably. But it might not be as big a deal or hotly argued. As I said, if the Cherry Street Mission turfed out the homeless because their building went to crap, we'd have had that on TV. If it was Section 8 housing or whatever, we'd have had that on TV. Both of them BEFORE it got to the point of turfing everyone out. And if I had the time to hit up Google I'd go pull the stories that were on TV regarding some of the housing complexes in Toledo. But since it's the CAC, for some STRANGE reason we didn't hear about any issues until AFTER the decision was made. If that doesn't smell fishy and raise some flags and provoke some questions, then people need to slam some Red Bulls and wake up.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:13:12 pm     #  

It appears that getting real jobs beyond delivering a newspaper once a week should be added to many of these artists' plans.

CAC looks like an interesting place, but if they cant pay their bills (including building maintenance), the doors should be padlocked.

posted by 6th_Floor on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:48:57 pm     #  

15 posted: I'm just wondering if this place housed a bunch of people who didn't have the label of "artists"--would people even be talking about it?

Nope. And add being in the OWE to the mix of reasons.

posted by 6th_Floor on Jan 23, 2014 at 11:50:57 pm     #  

anonymouscoward posted at 10:13:12 PM on Jan 23, 2014:
Starr15 posted at 09:57:42 PM on Jan 23, 2014:

I really don't care much about old houses that haven't been kept up and that shelter people who aren't decent enough to pay their rent.

What would interest me is to get the stories behind these "artists." Having been a professor at a university for 26 years, I learned that many of these types love to label themselves "artists" or "scholars." I found out that what most of us call "surfing the web" they called "research" and "scholars" were people who read lots of books about a particular subject.

I'm just wondering if this place housed a bunch of people who didn't have the label of "artists"--would people even be talking about it?

Probably. But it might not be as big a deal or hotly argued. As I said, if the Cherry Street Mission turfed out the homeless because their building went to crap, we'd have had that on TV. If it was Section 8 housing or whatever, we'd have had that on TV. Both of them BEFORE it got to the point of turfing everyone out. And if I had the time to hit up Google I'd go pull the stories that were on TV regarding some of the housing complexes in Toledo. But since it's the CAC, for some STRANGE reason we didn't hear about any issues until AFTER the decision was made. If that doesn't smell fishy and raise some flags and provoke some questions, then people need to slam some Red Bulls and wake up.

If you like this conspiracy, you'll LOVE the Franciscan Academy.

posted by justread on Jan 24, 2014 at 07:18:06 am     #   2 people liked this

Thank you for being a complete and utter asshole, justread, thus continuing to prove that the rich people like you in Toledo have no vested interest in making Toledo better and would rather spend their time being snotty assholes toward everyone who isn't a 1%er.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 24, 2014 at 10:32:51 am     #   1 person liked this

anonymouscoward posted at 09:32:51 AM on Jan 24, 2014:

Thank you for being a complete and utter asshole, justread, thus continuing to prove that the rich people like you in Toledo have no vested interest in making Toledo better and would rather spend their time being snotty assholes toward everyone who isn't a 1%er.

Hey, that article is right, anonynmous cowards DO create an uncivil atmosphere on the internet. :)

Btw... for the record, Toledo doesn't have any "1%ers."

They live in places like Scottsdale. :(

posted by justread on Jan 24, 2014 at 11:00:11 am     #   2 people liked this

justread posted at 01:07:45 PM on Jan 23, 2014:

I remember now why Cupcake was on /p/robation.

And perhaps it's time once again.

posted by justread on Jan 24, 2014 at 11:00:38 am     #  

justread posted at 10:00:38 AM on Jan 24, 2014:
justread posted at 01:07:45 PM on Jan 23, 2014:

I remember now why Cupcake was on /p/robation.

And perhaps it's time once again.

Nah, because you're been the one deliberately picking away at me. You know, deliberate inflammatory comments that contribute no substance to the discussion, like the ones you posted above.

Or you could start clicking the ! or contacting jr as to how I'm violating the posting guidelines more than you are at this point.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 24, 2014 at 11:12:14 am     #   1 person liked this

Some video, titled "Collingwood Arts Center closure takes residents by surprise"

http://www.13abc.com/video?clipId=9763740&autostart=true

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 24, 2014 at 11:16:59 am     #  

I was a fairly successful artist for about a quarter of a century. At one point, I looked into renting at CAC as a resident. This was back in the late 1990s. Let's just say I wasn't willing to suffer THAT much for my art. LOL!

When I read all the hubub about CAC shutting down and giving folks 30 days to find a new place to stay, I can't help but consider what the story would have been if this HADN'T been done: Record-breaking winter finally breaks the back of CAC structure/infrastructure. No electricity. No heat at all. Artists sue CAC for injury, inconvenience, damage to art supplies...

Two things that I think were major screw-ups:

Someone with an iron fist should have phased out residency tenants YEARS ago until repairs were made. Given the state of the building, I can't believe that the city even allowed them to let people live there.

In the absence of that, a similar iron fist should have been booting residents who didn't pay their rent. Letting that situation slide so badly was a favor to NO ONE.

Bottom line: I'm surprised all of this didn't happen a lot sooner. It's a shame it had to go down this way, but it could have been a lot worse.

[Personal note: "Being an artist", and doing it right, is hard work. I gave up the artsy life a few years ago when the economy started to nosedive, but before it had any impact on my livelihood. I was lucky to find a corporate job that was a perfect match for the skills I'd honed as a small business owner/artisan over the years. Not all artists are lazy. Not all lazy people are artists.]

posted by gamegrrl on Jan 24, 2014 at 11:30:05 am     #   8 people liked this

Gamegrrl's post is a really great perspective.

Gotta say, I'm not feelin' too much for these people at this point. There should be no expectation of permanent subsidization of living spaces because you declare yourself "an artist."

Even Michaelangelo had patrons who paid him for his artwork. Just because you can make a clay pot and paint it with some patterns doesn't make you an artist. It makes you a hobbyist, at most. And doesn't absolve you from basic human/society duties such as...oh I don't know...paying rent.

I love art. I really do and I have bought from local artists whose work I appreciate ("local" artists from all over the world). But if, in the aggregate, you can't even come up with a sawbuck from all your "artistry" to pay your ridiculously stupidly low rent, you're doing it wrong. Or you're an asshole trying to prove how much you "suffer" for your art, which is out-and-out pathetic.

Some of the most beautiful pieces in my house are from artists who do their passion (sculpture/painting/etc.) in their basement while still holding a job to pay the bills. The art sales are their fun money at this point--they have fun making the art, they have fun spending the money from it. Somehow, their artistry did not prevent them from becoming permanent wards "in residence" somewhere.

And I agree, it was only a matter of time before the maintenance issues led to a lawsuit from some disgruntled artist which would have shut the whole thing down anyway. This place was going away, no matter what.

posted by oldhometown on Jan 24, 2014 at 03:30:52 pm     #   2 people liked this

gamegrrl posted at 10:30:05 AM on Jan 24, 2014:

I was a fairly successful artist for about a quarter of a century. At one point, I looked into renting at CAC as a resident. This was back in the late 1990s. Let's just say I wasn't willing to suffer THAT much for my art. LOL!

When I read all the hubub about CAC shutting down and giving folks 30 days to find a new place to stay, I can't help but consider what the story would have been if this HADN'T been done: Record-breaking winter finally breaks the back of CAC structure/infrastructure. No electricity. No heat at all. Artists sue CAC for injury, inconvenience, damage to art supplies...

Two things that I think were major screw-ups:

Someone with an iron fist should have phased out residency tenants YEARS ago until repairs were made. Given the state of the building, I can't believe that the city even allowed them to let people live there.

In the absence of that, a similar iron fist should have been booting residents who didn't pay their rent. Letting that situation slide so badly was a favor to NO ONE.

Bottom line: I'm surprised all of this didn't happen a lot sooner. It's a shame it had to go down this way, but it could have been a lot worse.

[Personal note: "Being an artist", and doing it right, is hard work. I gave up the artsy life a few years ago when the economy started to nosedive, but before it had any impact on my livelihood. I was lucky to find a corporate job that was a perfect match for the skills I'd honed as a small business owner/artisan over the years. Not all artists are lazy. Not all lazy people are artists.]

Someone with an iron BUTT let things get this bad. Or many iron BUTTS, on the Board, because as was pointed out, the directorship is a revolving door. So how the hell can you fundraise and write grants if your butt is going out the door not long after it goes in the door? Who all is on the Board and how long have they been on it? Let's see the books get opened to the public! Break out the flashlights and start shining light all over the CAC! If they're not going to "bend over and spread 'em", then they're hiding something. Let's see the Coingate-level investigating going on here. They got US GOVERNMENT MONEY at one point, so where's all the right-wingers on this board who cried SOLYNDRA! and whine about government spending at right now? Y'all ought to be with me on this if you aren't hypocrites or RINOs (but I repeat myself).

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 24, 2014 at 06:53:01 pm     #   5 people liked this

speaking of fundraising: http://www.gofundme.com/6g2ezg
one of the artists living in the CAC is running a little funding project to help people move out. Looks like they've already raised close to $500 in a few hours.

I wish them the best!

posted by upso on Jan 24, 2014 at 07:42:53 pm     #   1 person liked this

anonymouscoward posted at 05:53:01 PM on Jan 24, 2014:
gamegrrl posted at 10:30:05 AM on Jan 24, 2014:

I was a fairly successful artist for about a quarter of a century. At one point, I looked into renting at CAC as a resident. This was back in the late 1990s. Let's just say I wasn't willing to suffer THAT much for my art. LOL!

When I read all the hubub about CAC shutting down and giving folks 30 days to find a new place to stay, I can't help but consider what the story would have been if this HADN'T been done: Record-breaking winter finally breaks the back of CAC structure/infrastructure. No electricity. No heat at all. Artists sue CAC for injury, inconvenience, damage to art supplies...

Two things that I think were major screw-ups:

Someone with an iron fist should have phased out residency tenants YEARS ago until repairs were made. Given the state of the building, I can't believe that the city even allowed them to let people live there.

In the absence of that, a similar iron fist should have been booting residents who didn't pay their rent. Letting that situation slide so badly was a favor to NO ONE.

Bottom line: I'm surprised all of this didn't happen a lot sooner. It's a shame it had to go down this way, but it could have been a lot worse.

[Personal note: "Being an artist", and doing it right, is hard work. I gave up the artsy life a few years ago when the economy started to nosedive, but before it had any impact on my livelihood. I was lucky to find a corporate job that was a perfect match for the skills I'd honed as a small business owner/artisan over the years. Not all artists are lazy. Not all lazy people are artists.]

Someone with an iron BUTT let things get this bad. Or many iron BUTTS, on the Board, because as was pointed out, the directorship is a revolving door. So how the hell can you fundraise and write grants if your butt is going out the door not long after it goes in the door? Who all is on the Board and how long have they been on it? Let's see the books get opened to the public! Break out the flashlights and start shining light all over the CAC! If they're not going to "bend over and spread 'em", then they're hiding something. Let's see the Coingate-level investigating going on here. They got US GOVERNMENT MONEY at one point, so where's all the right-wingers on this board who cried SOLYNDRA! and whine about government spending at right now? Y'all ought to be with me on this if you aren't hypocrites or RINOs (but I repeat myself).

Help, help!

He just made an arts issue /p/.

He made it /p/!!

OMG Help!!

posted by justread on Jan 24, 2014 at 09:07:16 pm     #   1 person liked this

Maybe it drank too much water, but every once in a while everyone has to go /p/.

posted by MIJeff on Jan 24, 2014 at 10:28:38 pm     #  

Again, the fact that justread, with his connections amongst the areas Rich and Powerful, is running around pulling these antics in the thread to distract from the issue, ought to be one hell of a telling sign that he really doesn't want anyone looking into the CAC's books or his buddies on the CAC Board. Otherwise, he would not be being such a jackass. Think about it. He's had near-zero meaningful contribution to the thread.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 24, 2014 at 10:53:58 pm     #  

Can you prove he has an interest in CaC?

posted by MIJeff on Jan 25, 2014 at 12:05:10 am     #  

MIJeff posted at 11:05:10 PM on Jan 24, 2014:

Can you prove he has an interest in CaC?

I did not say that, and in fact he made the accusation that I have an anti-CAC-leadership agenda, which, if you read the thread, was countered by me pointing out he seems to be white-knighting for them, which he's not specifically denied, all the while trying to re-write CAC history, claim I'm a conspiracy theorist, cry to jr that this thread needs to go to /p/, generally being inflammatory, and effectively not contributing substantively to the discussion.

In other words, he's acting a lot like I used to over in /p/-land, if you think about it. And I'm trying to be the rational one, in as much as I can while constrained by what I can say and show.

I've posted the food for thought. CAC's been residential from the start (counter to justread's claims), CAC's had lots of turnover in the directorship position, CAC board's make-up isn't exactly put out there, CAC used to have a section on their website for reports and no reports were put out there, CAC's needed repairs for years, gotten money for repairs, and where did it all go, CAC's gotten FEDERAL money for repairs, where's the accountability on that, questioned Fred's decision to host the director on-air but not actively invite any residents (until his decision was questioned!), if they really wanted to raise money to fix things and awareness of the condition of the building they had any number of outlets (media and Internet) to do so with, and so on. THINK about it for a while. Even if you take any kind of agenda I might have out of the equation, well the only parallel I can draw is the Cleveland Browns, where you wonder what and where the hell they're spending the money on (specifically in the coaches and players they've had), why they keep having such turnover in head coach and quarterback, why nothing has improved there, why every year is a "rebuilding year", and so forth.

I am not an investigative reporter, I'm just some Anonymous Coward and I only have a dinky little penlight to aim at some things with the hope that someone else with the big old million-candlepower spot and floodlights will go "huh, that's interesting..." and do some serious looking. Maybe Fred will have the fortitude to ask the director about all this on his show and we will learn something by what she says, or what she does not say.

I wish I could say more but that would give up my source(s).

I can suggest someone go phone up the previous director(s) for their opinion(s) if they care to share it. Might add something to this discussion or it might not. Or they might not choose to talk, or might not be able to talk, or might be accused of having an anti-CAC agenda.... Or maybe you might want to go have a talk with the soon-to-be-ex-residents for their stories, if they'll share any, or any other artists who have had much dealing with the CAC over a longer timespan.

Something's usually up when you get presented with one side of the story and the other side's not getting theirs out. Maybe there's an agenda there, or a fear of retribution, fear of change, Stockholm Syndrome, all those classic things that happen.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 25, 2014 at 02:30:11 am     #  

They haven't paid any property taxes since October 2010. At some point CAC was assessed at a lower amount per half, because their 6 month bill only is $134.

Current delinquent amount is : $30,211.20

The city and citizens of Toledo won't ever see a penny of that imho. Again, the rest of us either pay more or see reduced services because deadbeats won't pay what they owe.

It seems that the first step is to have a clean sweep and start over with a new board. Unfortunately, it may take shuttering CAC to force necessary changes.

posted by 6th_Floor on Jan 25, 2014 at 09:41:23 am     #   1 person liked this

anonymouscoward posted at 01:30:11 AM on Jan 25, 2014:
MIJeff posted at 11:05:10 PM on Jan 24, 2014:

Can you prove he has an interest in CaC?

I did not say that, and in fact he made the accusation that I have an anti-CAC-leadership agenda, which, if you read the thread, was countered by me pointing out he seems to be white-knighting for them, which he's not specifically denied, all the while trying to re-write CAC history, claim I'm a conspiracy theorist, cry to jr that this thread needs to go to /p/, generally being inflammatory, and effectively not contributing substantively to the discussion.

In other words, he's acting a lot like I used to over in /p/-land, if you think about it. And I'm trying to be the rational one, in as much as I can while constrained by what I can say and show.

I've posted the food for thought. CAC's been residential from the start (counter to justread's claims), CAC's had lots of turnover in the directorship position, CAC board's make-up isn't exactly put out there, CAC used to have a section on their website for reports and no reports were put out there, CAC's needed repairs for years, gotten money for repairs, and where did it all go, CAC's gotten FEDERAL money for repairs, where's the accountability on that, questioned Fred's decision to host the director on-air but not actively invite any residents (until his decision was questioned!), if they really wanted to raise money to fix things and awareness of the condition of the building they had any number of outlets (media and Internet) to do so with, and so on. THINK about it for a while. Even if you take any kind of agenda I might have out of the equation, well the only parallel I can draw is the Cleveland Browns, where you wonder what and where the hell they're spending the money on (specifically in the coaches and players they've had), why they keep having such turnover in head coach and quarterback, why nothing has improved there, why every year is a "rebuilding year", and so forth.

I am not an investigative reporter, I'm just some Anonymous Coward and I only have a dinky little penlight to aim at some things with the hope that someone else with the big old million-candlepower spot and floodlights will go "huh, that's interesting..." and do some serious looking. Maybe Fred will have the fortitude to ask the director about all this on his show and we will learn something by what she says, or what she does not say.

I wish I could say more but that would give up my source(s).

I can suggest someone go phone up the previous director(s) for their opinion(s) if they care to share it. Might add something to this discussion or it might not. Or they might not choose to talk, or might not be able to talk, or might be accused of having an anti-CAC agenda.... Or maybe you might want to go have a talk with the soon-to-be-ex-residents for their stories, if they'll share any, or any other artists who have had much dealing with the CAC over a longer timespan.

Something's usually up when you get presented with one side of the story and the other side's not getting theirs out. Maybe there's an agenda there, or a fear of retribution, fear of change, Stockholm Syndrome, all those classic things that happen.

I'm not a wife beater either. Why would I defend against wild guesses made on the internet by a complete stranger who has also called me Scrooge McDuck and Snidely Whiplash? It's not necessary.

As I pointed out waaayyyy at the top of the thread, my comment (with the box around it proving that it was of no value to anyone) was simply to provide a reasoned counterpoint to your suggestion of evil intent which must be retaliated against with vandalism.

My other post of relevance and value was this:

_Mission drift is a significant issue for organizations. It's a legitimate question which requires no special brass equipment to ask.
Organizations often get caught up in issues or expenses that are not central to their primary mission. They end up in circumstances in which they have to decide whether to let the side issues kill them, or focus on the primary mission.

I believe that Lois Nelson et al. were interested in promoting art as a cultural value, not supporting artists as a social welfare program. The social welfare program seemed to develop along the way, and obviously must be restructured for the primary mission elements to survive._

posted by justread on Jan 25, 2014 at 10:05:11 am     #   3 people liked this

MIJeff posted at 11:05:10 PM on Jan 24, 2014:

Can you prove he has an interest in CaC?

Couldn't have less. Never even been in the building, and couldn't pick a resident or a board member out of a lineup. The story wasn't even on my radar until AC posted this thread.

But I am extremely informed regarding organizations, the challenges that they face, and the difficult, yet right decisions that their leaders sometimes have to make.

Simply put, I thought that it was pretty stupid that AC called for an egging, and I provided a reasonable and civil alternate viewpoint. For that, my motives were called into question, and I was called things like "ass" and "asshole." I don't let that bother me, because I assume that like me, few posters take him seriously.

Besides, it's simply misplaced aggression caused by his fundamental unhappiness. It doesn't really have anything to do with me. I am fascination and pre-occupation for him and I could never live up to the evil that he dreams up in his mind to associate me with.
I wouldn't wish him more unhappiness. He has more than his share already.

posted by justread on Jan 25, 2014 at 10:12:35 am     #   3 people liked this

6th_Floor posted at 08:41:23 AM on Jan 25, 2014:

They haven't paid any property taxes since October 2010. At some point CAC was assessed at a lower amount per half, because their 6 month bill only is $134.

Current delinquent amount is : $30,211.20

The city and citizens of Toledo won't ever see a penny of that imho. Again, the rest of us either pay more or see reduced services because deadbeats won't pay what they owe.

It seems that the first step is to have a clean sweep and start over with a new board. Unfortunately, it may take shuttering CAC to force necessary changes.

Not that I don't actually agree with you, but if the CAC was some restaurant, we'd have 100 posts calling the owners deadbeat delinquents and wondering how the hell they keep failing the Restaurant Report Card. And there'd be calls for a thorough investigation of the business.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 25, 2014 at 12:40:37 pm     #   1 person liked this

justread posted at 09:12:35 AM on Jan 25, 2014:
MIJeff posted at 11:05:10 PM on Jan 24, 2014:

Can you prove he has an interest in CaC?

Couldn't have less. Never even been in the building, and couldn't pick a resident or a board member out of a lineup. The story wasn't even on my radar until AC posted this thread.

But I am extremely informed regarding organizations, the challenges that they face, and the difficult, yet right decisions that their leaders sometimes have to make.

Simply put, I thought that it was pretty stupid that AC called for an egging, and I provided a reasonable and civil alternate viewpoint. For that, my motives were called into question, and I was called things like "ass" and "asshole." I don't let that bother me, because I assume that like me, few posters take him seriously.

Besides, it's simply misplaced aggression caused by his fundamental unhappiness. It doesn't really have anything to do with me. I am fascination and pre-occupation for him and I could never live up to the evil that he dreams up in his mind to associate me with.
I wouldn't wish him more unhappiness. He has more than his share already.

"The story wasn't even on my radar until AC posted this thread."

"I was called things like "ass" and "asshole." I don't let that bother me"

"I am fascination and pre-occupation for him and I could never live up to the evil that he dreams up in his mind to associate me with."

Wow, that Narcissistic Personality Disorder sure is something.

Your claiming I'm obsessed with you, after your recent behavior, is like a fat person claiming those double bacon cheeseburgers, deluxe chili cheese fries, and the 2-liter of Diet Coke are obsessed with them.

As for not letting things bother you, why are you still going at posting?

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 25, 2014 at 12:50:56 pm     #  

anonymouscoward posted at 11:50:56 AM on Jan 25, 2014:
justread posted at 09:12:35 AM on Jan 25, 2014:
MIJeff posted at 11:05:10 PM on Jan 24, 2014:

Can you prove he has an interest in CaC?

Couldn't have less. Never even been in the building, and couldn't pick a resident or a board member out of a lineup. The story wasn't even on my radar until AC posted this thread.

But I am extremely informed regarding organizations, the challenges that they face, and the difficult, yet right decisions that their leaders sometimes have to make.

Simply put, I thought that it was pretty stupid that AC called for an egging, and I provided a reasonable and civil alternate viewpoint. For that, my motives were called into question, and I was called things like "ass" and "asshole." I don't let that bother me, because I assume that like me, few posters take him seriously.

Besides, it's simply misplaced aggression caused by his fundamental unhappiness. It doesn't really have anything to do with me. I am fascination and pre-occupation for him and I could never live up to the evil that he dreams up in his mind to associate me with.
I wouldn't wish him more unhappiness. He has more than his share already.

"The story wasn't even on my radar until AC posted this thread."

"I was called things like "ass" and "asshole." I don't let that bother me"

"I am fascination and pre-occupation for him and I could never live up to the evil that he dreams up in his mind to associate me with."

Wow, that Narcissistic Personality Disorder sure is something.

Your claiming I'm obsessed with you, after your recent behavior, is like a fat person claiming those double bacon cheeseburgers, deluxe chili cheese fries, and the 2-liter of Diet Coke are obsessed with them.

As for not letting things bother you, why are you still going at posting?

Which is it:
guilty due to lack of denial?
Or guilty due to reasoned, rational response?

Wait, don't answer. It's both.

posted by justread on Jan 25, 2014 at 12:53:50 pm     #   1 person liked this

justread posted at 11:53:50 AM on Jan 25, 2014:
anonymouscoward posted at 11:50:56 AM on Jan 25, 2014:
justread posted at 09:12:35 AM on Jan 25, 2014:
MIJeff posted at 11:05:10 PM on Jan 24, 2014:

Can you prove he has an interest in CaC?

Couldn't have less. Never even been in the building, and couldn't pick a resident or a board member out of a lineup. The story wasn't even on my radar until AC posted this thread.

But I am extremely informed regarding organizations, the challenges that they face, and the difficult, yet right decisions that their leaders sometimes have to make.

Simply put, I thought that it was pretty stupid that AC called for an egging, and I provided a reasonable and civil alternate viewpoint. For that, my motives were called into question, and I was called things like "ass" and "asshole." I don't let that bother me, because I assume that like me, few posters take him seriously.

Besides, it's simply misplaced aggression caused by his fundamental unhappiness. It doesn't really have anything to do with me. I am fascination and pre-occupation for him and I could never live up to the evil that he dreams up in his mind to associate me with.
I wouldn't wish him more unhappiness. He has more than his share already.

"The story wasn't even on my radar until AC posted this thread."

"I was called things like "ass" and "asshole." I don't let that bother me"

"I am fascination and pre-occupation for him and I could never live up to the evil that he dreams up in his mind to associate me with."

Wow, that Narcissistic Personality Disorder sure is something.

Your claiming I'm obsessed with you, after your recent behavior, is like a fat person claiming those double bacon cheeseburgers, deluxe chili cheese fries, and the 2-liter of Diet Coke are obsessed with them.

As for not letting things bother you, why are you still going at posting?

Which is it:
guilty due to lack of denial?

Or guilty due to reasoned, rational response?

Wait, don't answer. It's both.

Again, the question is asked, if you don't let these things bother you, then why are you still posting?

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 25, 2014 at 01:01:33 pm     #  

anonymouscoward posted at 12:01:33 PM on Jan 25, 2014:
justread posted at 11:53:50 AM on Jan 25, 2014:
anonymouscoward posted at 11:50:56 AM on Jan 25, 2014:
justread posted at 09:12:35 AM on Jan 25, 2014:
MIJeff posted at 11:05:10 PM on Jan 24, 2014:

Can you prove he has an interest in CaC?

Couldn't have less. Never even been in the building, and couldn't pick a resident or a board member out of a lineup. The story wasn't even on my radar until AC posted this thread.

But I am extremely informed regarding organizations, the challenges that they face, and the difficult, yet right decisions that their leaders sometimes have to make.

Simply put, I thought that it was pretty stupid that AC called for an egging, and I provided a reasonable and civil alternate viewpoint. For that, my motives were called into question, and I was called things like "ass" and "asshole." I don't let that bother me, because I assume that like me, few posters take him seriously.

Besides, it's simply misplaced aggression caused by his fundamental unhappiness. It doesn't really have anything to do with me. I am fascination and pre-occupation for him and I could never live up to the evil that he dreams up in his mind to associate me with.
I wouldn't wish him more unhappiness. He has more than his share already.

"The story wasn't even on my radar until AC posted this thread."

"I was called things like "ass" and "asshole." I don't let that bother me"

"I am fascination and pre-occupation for him and I could never live up to the evil that he dreams up in his mind to associate me with."

Wow, that Narcissistic Personality Disorder sure is something.

Your claiming I'm obsessed with you, after your recent behavior, is like a fat person claiming those double bacon cheeseburgers, deluxe chili cheese fries, and the 2-liter of Diet Coke are obsessed with them.

As for not letting things bother you, why are you still going at posting?

Which is it:
guilty due to lack of denial?


Or guilty due to reasoned, rational response?

Wait, don't answer. It's both.

Again, the question is asked, if you don't let these things bother you, then why are you still posting?

Posting doesn't indicate "bothered," cupcake.

Why are you still asking questions?

Wait... I know why. :D

posted by justread on Jan 25, 2014 at 02:49:18 pm     #  

Oh boy, so much name calling and hatred on this site, love it.
My experience with the CAC was through a few nomadic musician friends that moved to Toledo from Wisconsin, they did their interview and got in, their rooms were small but livable. They never got any access to an area in which "bands" did, they often complained about the kitchen area and stolen food, typical dorm room stuff. Rent was somewhat a joke, I gathered. The best was the story of a large guy, living their for awhile, that used to shit in a bucket in his room, and empty it from time to time in the community bathroom.
All in all, I never really felt a creative emergency from the CAC, events were sparse to the point that it seemed that the residence were just riding it out. Anyone I knew that lived there, looked at the CAC as temporary.

posted by toledobellows on Jan 25, 2014 at 10:26:32 pm     #  

I can't believe the direction this subject has taken! I have quite a bit of history with the CAC. I rented a studio there in the late 90's, and then I was on the Board of Directors in about 2002. During my studio days I never had anything to do with the residents, because in my opinion they were a bunch of loosers! There was no review panel in place, and rather than foster up and coming artists, it was nothing but a flophouse. After I gave up my studio, I was asked to be on the Board. I only lasted about 6 months because the behavior was so horrible and totally unprofessional. Also, they had no insurance on there Board Members, leaving us open to be sued individually. The Executive Director was too busy being chummy with the residents to enforce the rules, and from what I've heard, he was better than the one that followed him.
Over the years there have been some wonderful people who have devoted time and energy to CAC (Pat Tansey is certainly one of them, and Lee Murray was another), but without any strong corporate sponsorship, and a strong cohesive board, there is no hope for CAC. The building is a gem, and the idea for an artist colony is wonderful, but the residential portion just doesn't work.

posted by beenthere on Jan 27, 2014 at 02:54:13 am     #  

"no review panel in place"

"I was asked to be on the Board. I only lasted about 6 months because the behavior was so horrible and totally unprofessional. Also, they had no insurance on there Board Members, leaving us open to be sued individually. The Executive Director was too busy being chummy with the residents to enforce the rules, and from what I've heard, he was better than the one that followed him."

"but without any strong corporate sponsorship, and a strong cohesive board, there is no hope for CAC"

Yeah, maybe that's why nothing ever got fixed.

posted by anonymouscoward on Jan 27, 2014 at 10:21:27 am     #  

__Rent was somewhat a joke, I gathered. The best was the story of a large guy, living their for awhile, that used to shit in a bucket in his room, and empty it from time to time in the community bathroom. __

Sounds like a heckuva place to air a reality show!

posted by 6th_Floor on Jan 27, 2014 at 11:47:44 am     #   1 person liked this

I wonder if there is someone quietly looking to redevelop the place as condos or something and the board is using these "conditions" to deal with the residents before negotiations start? That is an amazing building, it wouldn't surprise me if that were the case. And for the record, it is just my imagination thinking aloud, I have no knowledge what-so-ever about this or the place in general.

Also, yes there are trade schools like Penta, Owens skilled trades classes, and apprenticeships that would help with construction and repairs as part of their hands on training; free of charge. Its been done in and around the area on many occasions, so this is definitely something they could have asked for help with.

posted by tm2 on Jan 27, 2014 at 12:09:43 pm     #   1 person liked this

I will start my post with a disclaimer that I know absolutely nothing about the inner workings of the CAC, what condition the building is in, or anything of that nature. Purely stating from buildings and rents in general:

Things like this always irk me. On the one hand, you have a gorgeous old building that you would like to preserve any way you can. In general, the older and more stately the building, the more it costs to maintain. First, you have the fact that it was built before we had our current standards of efficiency, so utilities will be higher than usual. Second, a building like this has a lot of decorative appointments, which carry with them general maintenance expenses that you wouldn't have otherwise. In other words, you have a significant portion of your revenues going toward aesthetic upkeep.

On the other, you have people who need help getting on their feet. It's great to help starving artists who may not have the resources yet to support what they intend to do. But why... WHY... would you put them up in a building that so clearly requires significant revenues to keep up? Wouldn't it be more logical to run this artists colony / low income housing project in a building that costs as little as possible to maintain? This just seems like a business plan that is bound for failure at the outset.

posted by Johio83 on Jan 27, 2014 at 12:37:38 pm     #   3 people liked this

I went to cac today to get some footage and while there I was able to speak with a couple residents. They had plenty to say but I decided to turn off the video and they invited me inside for a guest tour. I did not record anything while inside. This was my first time inside and for sure cac is a unique place and nicer than I expected. I informed a few residents about toledotalk and hopefully they'll post here about the situation. They were concerned about being edited by media and I said I was pretty sure jr would permit them full free speech about the cac situation. I also Informed them about blade writer and owe resident nolan rosenkrans being a regular tt contributor. I ended the visit with buying something from an artist and giving him a ride to and from a nearby business. Its disgusting toledo is wasting a couple million at promenade park that wont add anything useful or unique to the city while toledo treasures such as cac are allowed to crumble. I left cac with a much more positive opinion about than I had when I arrived.

posted by EconCat88 on Jan 27, 2014 at 03:21:19 pm     #   4 people liked this

Nice post econCat-

This just popped up in the City Paper-sort of interesting, but not a ton of new info:

http://www.toledocitypaper.com/January-Issue-1-2014/Inside-the-Collingwood-Arts-Center/

posted by ahmahler on Jan 27, 2014 at 03:42:50 pm     #   1 person liked this

Great post Econ. Let me know next time you're in the neighborhood. I would love to grab a cup of coffee with you.

As for CAC residents, it's been a real bummer to see everyone going through this struggle on facebook. Looks like several artists are planning on leaving Toledo because of this.

posted by upso on Jan 27, 2014 at 03:57:46 pm     #  

Someone left Toledo to find a cheap flophouse? Good luck with that.

posted by justread on Jan 27, 2014 at 08:56:06 pm     #  

You know, I'm sad that this is happening, but this kind of thing DOES happen in the world. You just pick yourself up and do what you need to do. Sure, it probably won't be as 'Bohemian' and 'free spirited' as living in a dirt-cheap or no-rent situation, but it is what it is.

I would LOVE to have a sponsor who would fund me to just "be me" and "make art", but until that happens I am working 40+ hours a week at a corporate job because I value having a home and food and (perceived) security. I work. I earn. I reap the harvest every time I pay my bills or improve my life or take care of those I love.

Frankly, I'm aghast at some of the spew I'm reading on Facebook from "displaced artists". There's some serious craziness going on. And more than a couple of people who have gotten WAY to used to having a free place to live.

Welcome to the real world, folks.

posted by gamegrrl on Jan 28, 2014 at 03:14:07 pm     #   8 people liked this

to = too

posted by gamegrrl on Jan 28, 2014 at 03:29:52 pm     #  

I told my daughter that it was ok if she goes "Vegan," but NOT "Freegan."

posted by justread on Jan 28, 2014 at 03:37:25 pm     #   2 people liked this

So it should read "welcome too the real world?" That doesn't make any sense...

jk, jk :)

And I agree about the negative comments being thrown around. Facebook walls can sometimes read like they're the dictation from a group of 6th graders plotting against the faculty. One makes an assertion that he knows nothing about, and six others back it up with "yeah, he's right!" and it builds from there.

The biggest complaint is certainly the timing of it, and only allowing 30 days. But after that, I'd say the second most frequent complaint is people insinuating that this is all just a ploy to get them out, since the residences are closing, but the work spaces are remaining open. That's entirely because living spaces have incredibly strict codes. Work spaces can be just about anything, for the most part. Got four walls and a roof? Work space, permit approved! Oh, you put a bed in the corner? Alright, here's a list of your violations.

posted by Johio83 on Jan 28, 2014 at 03:40:23 pm     #   1 person liked this

One of the most unusual, in my opinion, is the person putting a "blood curse" on the CAC.

posted by gamegrrl on Jan 28, 2014 at 04:13:39 pm     #  

Wow. The CAC as fall of Jerusalem. Melodramatic and Messianic artsy bums.

posted by justread on Jan 28, 2014 at 06:14:09 pm     #  

What arts did those people do, acting?

posted by MIJeff on Jan 28, 2014 at 06:51:01 pm     #  

Hope this isn't seen as self promotion, but I had Sarah Kurfis on with me this morning. Skip the birthday song at the beginning and hear what she has to say about mismanagement, residents, and the future of the CAC. http://www.wspd.com/media/podcast-fred-lefebvre-podcasts-Fred/130-sarah-kurfis-on-the-collingwood-24258656/

posted by fred on Jan 30, 2014 at 10:21:45 am     #  

From an e-mail that I received:

End of the Line: Final Collingwood Arts Center Residents Show - Saturday, February 22 7PM-11PM

The Collingwood Arts Center's last residential art show, featuring unique visual artists, live musical performances and spoken word performances.

Please help the residents of the Collingwood Arts Center raise funds to facilitate their relocation.

As you may have heard, the Collingwood Arts Center has discontinued their residency program due to significant infrastructure issues. This decision has resulted in the 28 resident artists being forced to find new homes in only 30 days.

We will have art work for sale and auction, live performers and more in our community's last art show. For more information, stay tuned and RSVP on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/events/204530939753507/

posted by jr on Feb 20, 2014 at 03:28:46 pm     #