Toledo Talk

Seriously?!? We're still at a Level II?!?

I know we have a 'new sheriff in town', with Tharp only being in office for a year or so, but seriously? Why are we still at a Level II Snow Emergency. We have been at this level since approximately 10:30 pm Saturday night (I reviewed the text messages I get from WTOL/Channel 11 to confirm the time).

Yes, it is cold; yes there are snow on the roads; yes it is windy. But it is ridiculous to expect "...that only people with a real and important need to be out on the roads and streets should do so" after 72 hours. Even after one day I thought it was stupid. Move it to a Level I, which states "This means that roadways are hazardous with blowing and drifting snow. Roads are also icy. Drive very cautiously."

People will (are) ignoring the snow emergency levels and will begin to build a disregard for their intent to warn drivers if they continue to use them as they have been.

created by MrsArcher on Jan 28, 2014 at 01:46:02 pm     Outdoors     Comments: 46

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Who cares?? The only time your not supposed to be on the roads is during a level 3.

posted by lfrost2125 on Jan 28, 2014 at 01:52:45 pm     #   5 people liked this

I suppose the Level II reflects the fact that chemical road treatments are about useless right now, that there are lots of patches of hidden ice, and that unprotected skin will freeze in minutes.

And as lfrost2125 noted, this really does not affect anyone's right to go about their business.

Yesterday morning I saw dozens of vehicles off the road traveling between Toledo and BG. Just 25 miles or so, and it looked like a tornado had whipped through. Even with light traffic speeds were reduced to 40 mph or so.

And yet the sun was shining.

If it makes you feel better, MrsArcher, in Wood County the sheriff seems to be the least likely to issue snow emergencies of any type. In near-blizzard conditions yesterday he only went to Level I, and on local boards and news sites people were blown away (see what I did there) that the WC sheriff refused to go to Level II.

BTW: why does this issue get you so riled up? I am not being snarky, just genuinely curious.

posted by historymike on Jan 28, 2014 at 02:12:22 pm     #   1 person liked this

13ABC says Lucas County is at a Level I, by the way.

posted by historymike on Jan 28, 2014 at 02:14:13 pm     #  

BTW: why does this issue get you so riled up? I am not being snarky, just genuinely curious.

First, because I believe it negatively impacts commerce and the economy. I'm not saying commerce should overrule safety, but at some point we have to acknowledge we live in northern Ohio and its cold and snowy in the winter.

Second, because at this point I think it is also leading to a complacency for the severity of the weather, when it is posted for long periods of time like this. If there is not a true distinction between Level I and Level II and even Level III, then it doesn't matter what level they post, people will ignore it.

posted by MrsArcher on Jan 28, 2014 at 02:26:08 pm     #   4 people liked this

historymike posted at 01:14:13 PM on Jan 28, 2014:

13ABC says Lucas County is at a Level I, by the way.

Interesting, county website still shows it at Level II:

http://www.co.lucas.oh.us/

Probably should do a screen shot because this may change at any time.

posted by MrsArcher on Jan 28, 2014 at 02:28:22 pm     #  

You are correct that it still says level II on the Lucas County website. I did receive an alert e-mail from Lucas County at 12:02 p.m. announcing the downgrade to level I.

posted by Spaceace on Jan 28, 2014 at 02:37:34 pm     #  

13ABC News at Noon had Lucas County at Level 1

posted by Hoops on Jan 28, 2014 at 02:49:03 pm     #  

Okay, so Lucas County hasn't updated their website, but that still put us at a level 2 for 72 hours. Can you honestly say the roads are better today than they were yesterday? I'll admit it snowed Sunday morning and I stayed home, so I don't know what they were like, but where they any different than today?

posted by MrsArcher on Jan 28, 2014 at 03:05:04 pm     #  

Updates at ToledoNewsNow.com. Yellow snow alert??

Lenawee County has issued a level B-snow condition yellow, effective at 4 p.m. Monday.

This means that road conditions are extremely hazardous with heavy snow, severe drifting and/or widespread ice. Generally, only one lane is open for traffic, which is moving at a slow speed with occasional stalled vehicles. Motorists are urged to curtail driving unless there is an emergency.

"Generally, only one lane is open for traffic, which is moving at a slow speed with occasional stalled vehicles."

That sounds like road construction on a hot summer day.

At home this morning, we escalated to a Level 8 Snow Emergency due to being low on coffee beans.

Imagine the crisis mode in the madjack homestead when bourbon is running low.

I've concluded that these snow emergency levels are relative to each individual.

posted by jr on Jan 28, 2014 at 03:08:58 pm     #   1 person liked this

I am at a snow level 1, a cold level 4, and a leaf pickup level 100.

posted by justread on Jan 28, 2014 at 03:35:20 pm     #   1 person liked this

Lenawee County has issued a level B-snow condition yellow, effective at 4 p.m. Monday.

That sounds more like a warning not to eat the yellow snow than a road condition.

posted by MrsArcher on Jan 28, 2014 at 03:37:01 pm     #   1 person liked this

Yellow snow is it's own warning.

posted by justread on Jan 28, 2014 at 03:38:14 pm     #   4 people liked this

I didn't realize we were still under a snow emergency, but the level I has now been canceled. Maybe it was canceled so Lucas County can reissue it on Saturday!

posted by Spaceace on Jan 30, 2014 at 01:16:02 pm     #   1 person liked this

Ok. I have been out. If there was ever a time to play the level 3 card, it's NOW.

Knock knock. Tharp. Wake up buddy.

If you do not have to drive, DO NOT go out right now. The snow on top of the ice is a bad combination.

Don't rely on a county employee to make the right call.

posted by justread on Feb 05, 2014 at 08:05:16 am     #   5 people liked this

dude, they called a level 3 at 11pm last night. :)

posted by nana on Feb 05, 2014 at 08:56:25 am     #  

And then lifted it early this morning....brilliant. Let's call a level 3 from 11:30pm-5:30 am to keep people safe and off the road so we can plow...because you know, the roads are jammed at that time anyway. Then lets lift it so all the idiots can try to go to work and get in an accident.

posted by MattL on Feb 05, 2014 at 09:02:12 am     #   1 person liked this

Yep. By 7:00 a.m., Wood and Lucas counties were under a Level 2.

According to radar, the snow has ended in southern Wood County. A knotch of dry weather is advancing northeast, and it may soon end the snowfall in Toledo. Snow in northern Indiana may enter our area later.

8:02 a.m.

posted by jr on Feb 05, 2014 at 09:12:07 am     #  

Blade story

Lucas County downgraded its snow emergency to a Level 2 about 5:30 a.m. Overnight work on city streets went "snowingly well," the mayor said early this morning. He predicted that the county would not return to a Level 3 today.

Some businesses may have announced their closings to their employees before 5:30 a.m. with the assumption that the level 3 would continue, especially with the heavier snow falling at that time, unless the sheriff announced hours earlier that the county would downgrade to level 2 by 5:30 a.m.

posted by jr on Feb 05, 2014 at 09:23:34 am     #  

Driving in this mess is stupid. I kept getting stuck in my neighborhood.

posted by savah1128 on Feb 05, 2014 at 09:35:43 am     #  

nana posted at 07:56:25 AM on Feb 05, 2014:

dude, they called a level 3 at 11pm last night. :)

But then the puppeteer that controls the sheriff stuck his hand back in the hole in the back of the shirt and called it off just in time for the worst part of the storm so that a bunch of non-essential people could drive their Kias to work and then have to fight home in a level 3 when he finally wakes up from his dazed caused by his hat being too tight.

posted by justread on Feb 05, 2014 at 09:40:41 am     #   8 people liked this

I'm not seeing much evidence that Toledo's overnight plowing efforts had much impact. Roads are rough - traffic seems strangely light though for only level 2! Suspect many are sleeping in unaware of this downgrade.

posted by bam2 on Feb 05, 2014 at 09:51:47 am     #  

When asked what would make him change his mind and raise the level, Sheriff Tharp replied, "I dunno, peer pressure, I guess."

posted by justread on Feb 05, 2014 at 09:58:01 am     #   3 people liked this

I'm just cracking jokes at this point. I realize that anybody who relied on a level 3 to prevent them from having to go to work have already been endangered by the bad leadership exhibited this morning.

posted by justread on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:00:44 am     #   2 people liked this

We are now a level 3.

posted by savah1128 on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:05:50 am     #  

Oh my God, what a freaking IDIOT!

posted by justread on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:09:15 am     #   8 people liked this

I love how the Blade article mentions the casino is open.

posted by JohnnyMac on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:16:24 am     #  

justread posted at 08:58:01 AM on Feb 05, 2014:

When asked what would make him change his mind and raise the level, Sheriff Tharp replied, "I dunno, peer pressure, I guess."

I don't believe this one... Tharp doesn't know what 'peer pressure' is. What's he doing, looking for a pressure gauge somewhere?

posted by madjack on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:21:31 am     #  

So they lowered it to a Level 2 for the morning rush. So now that we're all at work, it's back up to 3. What the flying...

Also, I'm in a bad mood because of how ridiculously awful the roads are. That was the worst drive of my life. I honestly don't know that I got more than 30 yards at any point in my drive without losing traction.

posted by Johio83 on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:31:41 am     #   2 people liked this

Brilliant. Day cares are closing because of the level 3. Soooo... if you dropped junior and princess off a couple of hours ago, now you have to go pick them up.

posted by justread on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:31:45 am     #   1 person liked this

Agreed. My wife's preschool told her to stand by for the time being, because they're "going to see how many kids show up first." So what's their plan, if only 3 show up, they're going to close and tell those kids to find a way to get home again?

posted by Johio83 on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:35:22 am     #  

bam2 posted at 08:51:47 AM on Feb 05, 2014:

I'm not seeing much evidence that Toledo's overnight plowing efforts had much impact. Roads are rough - traffic seems strangely light though for only level 2! Suspect many are sleeping in unaware of this downgrade.

That's probably because most of the snow has fallen after 5:30 a.m. when the snow emergency was downgraded.

According to Toledo Express Airport data, it seems that the heavier snow began falling after 6:00 a.m.

The snow intensity at 7:00 a.m. was at least heavy. I'm guessing that 1.0 to 1.5 inches of snow fell between 6:00 a.m. and 7:00 a.m.

I do know that as of 9:00 a.m., 3.0 inches of snow fell during the previous two hours.

With a total snowfall of at least 7.0 inches, it's probable that 4 to 5 inches of that snow fell between 5:30 a.m. and 9:00 a.m. At least in West Toledo.

A snowfall rate of over one inch per hour is probably going to overwhelm the snow removal crews.

Since 8:30 a.m., the snow intensity has been light, so the accumulation rate has dropped significantly. That should help the road crews catch up.

According to radar, it appears that the snow in northern Indiana and western Ohio will move into Toledo, so it may snow for the rest of the morning, but I doubt that we average 1.5 inches per hour. The snow intensity will probably remain light. Maybe we get 1 to 2 inches more total snow by the time it ends later today.

posted by jr on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:40:59 am     #  

The roads were worse this morning than any of the previous storms. Luckily I have a 4×4 and only have to drive downtown from Oregon, but I can't imagine anyone who had to drive to the other side of town in a little 2WD grocery getter. Not sure who was making the road level decisions but they need to pull their head out of their ass. This is bullshit and I hope they realize how stupid they are making themselves look.

posted by hunkytownsausage on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:43:30 am     #   3 people liked this

The drive in this am (that, for me, went back to a level 3 as I approached my office) was far worse than the drive when we were last under a level 3.

I can't really blame the road crews. I had my driveway cleared by 6:30 - then started over because the snow was falling at an unbelievable rate. I finally gave up about 7:15 and headed for the shower. By the time I left for work an hour later, there was an additional 4 inches that piled up. I haven't seen snow come down like that in years.

On the plus side, it does add a bit of a cushion to the pothole-ridden AW Trail.

posted by Foodie on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:43:33 am     #   1 person liked this

Stating the obvious, but snowing at a rate of 1.5 inches per hour for at least 3 hours will cause problems, especially when it falls during the morning rush.

posted by jr on Feb 05, 2014 at 10:51:05 am     #  

So lets be honest. The sheriff got all kinds of crap for the previous extended level 3. So now he get's gun shy on declaring a level 3, lets everyone drive to work, to then declare a level 3? Emotional decision making at its worst.

posted by MrGlass419 on Feb 05, 2014 at 11:21:27 am     #   2 people liked this

Of course the current rate of snow is going to cause problems, Collins would have been well advised to not boast of the "snowingly well" overnight efforts, Tharp shouldn't have assumed that with "six to seven hours of plowing, they'd be ahead of it", and Collins shouldn't have suggested that we would not go back to level 3 today.

Hats off the fine efforts of those actually doing yeoman’s work clearing our roads -- no hat tip to the higher ups making decisions, they just look silly.

posted by bam2 on Feb 05, 2014 at 11:25:55 am     #  

Got a text that the office would open at noon, now closed for the day. Zac Brown concert still going on tonight per HC. I am going no where today

posted by Hoops on Feb 05, 2014 at 11:42:04 am     #  

At 7 a.m. this morning I travelled on 23 from Sylvania to Maumee and the highway was bad and the visibility was terrible. The exit ramp at Dussel was basically impassible.

So did the sheriff want people to get to work and then put the Level III back on? Makes it difficult for people with children in day cares since they close at Level 3.

posted by Starr15 on Feb 05, 2014 at 11:55:13 am     #  

This made sense to me: http://www.toledoblade.com/local/2014/02/05/Multiple-spinoffs-reported-as-snow-keeps-falling.html

“We thought that … if there are six to seven hours of plowing, they'd be ahead of it, but then this burst came through,” the sheriff said. “ … I never thought we were going to get this burst we got all at one time, so now we're getting calls that some of the roads are impassable.”

&

“Go directly home,” the sheriff said. “We can't hold them hostage in their workplace, it's just common sense that they need to get home to their families.”

posted by toledolen_ on Feb 05, 2014 at 12:38:20 pm     #  

Also...

Although the sheriff doesn't expect that people going home after a workplace closure should be cited, “if someone is out there driving 50 mph where they should be driving 25, I'm sure they'll get a ticket. Please quote me on that,” the sheriff said.

posted by toledolen_ on Feb 05, 2014 at 12:40:52 pm     #  

So, when it comes right down to it Mother Nature always holds the aces.

posted by OnePlainPerson on Feb 05, 2014 at 01:42:15 pm     #  

toledolen_ posted at 11:40:52 AM on Feb 05, 2014:

Also...

Although the sheriff doesn't expect that people going home after a workplace closure should be cited, “if someone is out there driving 50 mph where they should be driving 25, I'm sure they'll get a ticket. Please quote me on that,” the sheriff said.

Waiting for someone to say that this is a communist and totalitarian socialist nazi move.

posted by endcycle on Feb 05, 2014 at 03:45:09 pm     #  

Will be Level 2 as of 3:30 pm

posted by wahhutch9 on Feb 05, 2014 at 04:03:44 pm     #  

endcycle posted at 02:45:09 PM on Feb 05, 2014:
toledolen_ posted at 11:40:52 AM on Feb 05, 2014:

Also...

Although the sheriff doesn't expect that people going home after a workplace closure should be cited, “if someone is out there driving 50 mph where they should be driving 25, I'm sure they'll get a ticket. Please quote me on that,” the sheriff said.

Waiting for someone to say that this is a communist and totalitarian socialist nazi move.

They should be ticketing people for "unsafe operation of a motor vehicle." Too few people use common sense when driving in adverse driving conditions, I find it amusing to see people passing me in a 4 wheel drive truck in cars only later to see them off the road in a ditch, I like to call it Karma.

posted by MIJeff on Feb 05, 2014 at 08:18:59 pm     #   1 person liked this

Carma

posted by upso on Feb 05, 2014 at 08:50:45 pm     #   4 people liked this

I had to laugh my ass off last Saturday. We entered 475 EB at Douglas on our way to church. As I merged over one lane, I noticed a car quite a ways back in the next lane over, which is the next lane I was going to merge into. I started moving over and then noticed the car was coming up quick, real quick. I moved back over (to get out of his way). He cruises past me in his Mercedes, shoots me a dirty look and blasts his horn, all while doing at least 80 mph. If you remember last Saturday we started with snow and then to lots and lots of rain. Well, we get to the new Promedica Parkway area, and I see his Mercedes' brake lights come on and suddenly the eastbound car is facing north, then it is spinning and facing south, then west! North and south again before regaining control. The guy had to have shit his pants at least 3 times. I thought I was going to have the opportunity to pass him and give him a sarcastic "thumbs up", but the dude kept right on flying. Amazing.

posted by llz on Feb 06, 2014 at 01:36:11 pm     #