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I guess I'm happy to be in an "Excellent with Distinction" district. (Even though my kids go to Catholic school anyhow.)

But it still makes me sad for the residents of TPS. From the details, it doesn't sound like the bump from "Academic Watch" to "Continuous Improvement" was the sign of any real progress. What a shame.

posted by mom2 on Aug 26, 2008 at 11:28:16 pm     #

Prediction: COSI will use these figures to bolster their levy request.

posted by GraphicsGuy on Aug 27, 2008 at 12:32:23 am     #

jr or others, maybe you can answer this question for me: Ottawa Hills' school district (according to its Superintendent's staff) does not accept out-of-district students, but DOES accept "tuition" students (at approximately $9,800 annually). The state will not allow O.H. to offer scholarships (again, this is what the staff said). Does this make sense to anybody?

posted by MrsPhoenix on Aug 27, 2008 at 05:49:48 am     #

So if you get straight As at a failing school, does that make you a failure?

Or doesn't sending your kid to a failing school make you a failure as a parent?

Education is a controlled substance apparently MrsPhoenix.

posted by charlatan on Aug 27, 2008 at 07:44:57 am     #

"Education is a controlled substance ..."

Indeed. Many oppose school vouchers, which give kids at failing public schools a chance for something better.

May 2007 - Toledo Blade - TPS rallies for Strickland education plan :

The governor's plan calls for an end to Ohio's statewide voucher program that uses public money to pay private school tuition for children in low-scoring schools, a moratorium on the creation of new charter schools, and a prohibition against charter schools being run by private, for-profit companies.

April 2007 letter to the Blade :

It is distressing that Ted Strickland, in one of his first initiatives as governor, proposes taking away freedom of choice in education given to his constituency by the legislature.

How ironic that he stated, "Wastefulness and giveaways can no longer be tolerated" as the reason why the EdChoice voucher program must be eliminated.

It is precisely because wastefulness and giveaways can no longer be tolerated that the EdChoice voucher program was initiated in Ohio and why it is sweeping the country from coast to coast.

Taxpayer money given in vouchers is not wasted; it is, rather, a very good use of taxpayer money, as evidenced by the success of private and parochial school students. Nationally and locally, a host of civic, business, professional, legal, and educational leaders are products of private and parochial schools.

Governor Strickland is clearly out of step with the majority of Americans on this issue. Like most anti-choice voices, he is more concerned with propping up failing systems than with serving people that the systems are failing.

Speak up now to preserve freedom of choice!

RONALD OLSZEWSKI

President
St. Francis de Sales High School

April 2008 - Toledo Blade - Interest in tuition vouchers up in Ohio; More students seek plan; more schools accept

Don't know the latest voucher info for the 2008-2009 school year, but for last year :

The following school buildings have been in academic emergency or academic watch for two of the last three years, making their students eligible to apply for vouchers:

TOLEDO
Chase Elementary
Cherry Elementary *
Fulton Elementary
Garfield Elementary
Nathan Hale Elementary *
Jones Elementary
Lagrange Elementary
Leverette Elementary
Libbey High
Lincoln Academy for Boys
McTigue Junior High
Newbury Elementary
Pickett Elementary *
Raymer Elementary
Reynolds Elementary
Robinson Junior High
Scott High *
Sherman Elementary
Woodward High *

(*) Currently in program

SOURCE: Ohio Department of Education

posted by jr on Aug 27, 2008 at 08:11:04 am     #

Many oppose school vouchers, which give kids at failing public schools a chance for something better

I agree with Charlatan's assessment. If you get A's at a failing school, does that make you a failure? Vouchers are a scam.

posted by pink_slip on Aug 27, 2008 at 08:24:08 am     #

"Vouchers are a scam."

What evidence do you have to support that claim?

"If you get A's at a failing school, does that make you a failure?"

It means the student is an A-student. The student is not a failure. The failing grade applies to the building. It's an overall grade based upon all the students' scores in that building. You know that.

2007-2008 info for Pickett Elementary :

Building Rating = Academic Emergency (Grade F)

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 3rd Grade Reading Achievement Test (2007-08) = 39.7

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 3rd Grade Math Achievement Test (2007-08) = 42.6

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 4th Grade Reading Achievement Test (2007-08) = 37.0

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 4th Grade Math Achievement Test (2007-08) = 38.3

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 4th Grade Writing Achievement Test (2007-08) = 51.1

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 5th Grade Reading Achievement Test (2007-08) = 27.1

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 5th Grade Math Achievement Test (2007-08) = 22.0

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 5th Grade Social Studies Achievement Test (2007-08) = 16.9

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 5th Grade Science Achievement Test (2007-08) = 10.2

Student Attendance Rate (2007-08) = 95.5

Attendance looks good. Even though the number of students scoring proficient or higher is low, it doesn't mean all the students are failing.

posted by jr on Aug 27, 2008 at 08:57:22 am     #

Vouchers are just another taxpayer subsidy to private industry. It amounts as a form of double taxation since we already fund public schools. Vouchers ensure that we also fund private schools as well. There is also no evidence that schools receiving voucher money perform any better than public schools. Often, as voucher programs in Milwaukee, Cleveland, and DC have shown us, the opposite is true. It all adds up. (X + Y)/Z = SCAM

posted by pink_slip on Aug 27, 2008 at 09:22:27 am     #

"There is also no evidence that schools receiving voucher money perform any better than public schools."

What about the student who uses the voucher money to enroll in another school? Does that student perform better?

What about those parents or guardians who cannot afford to move to a better school district or cannot afford a private school? Should these people be denied school choice? Should their kids be forced to attend failing public schools?

If you're worried about wasting taxpayer money, what about the millions of dollars wasted on public schools that get a failing grade year after year? Why do some school buildings perform poorly while others do well?

2007-2008 info for Elmhurst Elementary :

Building Rating: Excellent (Grade A)

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 3rd Grade Reading Achievement Test (2007-08) = 96.4

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 3rd Grade Math Achievement Test (2007-08) = 90.6

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 4th Grade Reading Achievement Test (2007-08) = 82.2

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 4th Grade Math Achievement Test (2007-08) = 77.8

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 4th Grade Writing Achievement Test (2007-08) = 80.0

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 5th Grade Reading Achievement Test (2007-08) = 87.8

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 5th Grade Math Achievement Test (2007-08) = 71.4

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 5th Grade Social Studies Achievement Test (2007-08) = 77.6

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 5th Grade Science Achievement Test (2007-08) = 77.6

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 6th Grade Reading Achievement Test (2007-08) = 91.2

Percentage of Students Who Scored Proficient or Higher on the 6th Grade Math Achievement Test (2007-08) = 82.4

Student Attendance Rate (2007-08) = 96.9

Elmhurst Elementary begins the 2008-2009 school year in a new building that includes a pond to support their youth bass fishing program.

posted by jr on Aug 27, 2008 at 10:25:29 am     #

What about the student who uses the voucher money to enroll in another school? Does that student perform better?

Nope.

What about those parents or guardians who cannot afford to move to a better school district or cannot afford a private school? Should these people be denied school choice? Should their kids be forced to attend failing public schools?

In order to answer this, I would need more info. If the student is doing well, why would they want to leave? If the student is not doing well, then they have the choice to study harder. The parents can choose to get more involved with the child's education.

Why do some school buildings perform poorly while others do well?

Buildings don't perform.

posted by pink_slip on Aug 27, 2008 at 10:50:21 am     #

My and my husband's experience so far with McTigue admin. has been surprisingly good. Our daughter stayed on the Principal's List averaging a 3.9 throughout 5th grade. On the Otis-Lennon School Ability test, she scored a 136 rating in the "Gifted" category. On her OATs, she scored in the "Accelerated" level for both Reading & Social Studies and "Advanced" in Math. Her lowest score was "Proficient" in Science. Once her McTigue counselor saw these scores during last week's Schedule Pick-Up day, she instantly changed her schedule to all Honors classes in those core subjects (including her "weakest" subject: Science).

posted by MrsPhoenix on Aug 27, 2008 at 11:01:53 am     #

"Buildings don't perform."

Tell that to the Ohio Department of Education. These are the government's words: "Building Rating:" .

To comply with pink_slip's word games, why do students in some TPS schools perform much better than students in other TPS schools?

And why does one Toledo school district score and rate much higher than the other Toledo school district?

District Name	Rating	Standards Met	AYP	PI Score	Value Added-Measure
Toledo	Continuous Improvement	5	Not Met	80.1	Below
Washington Local	Excellent	21	Met	94.4	Above

In September 2005, Carty Finkbeiner said :

Toledo has two public schools systems -- Toledo and Washington Local. The Washington Local School District offers a startling contrast when compared to Toledo Public Schools. In state proficiency ratings, Washington Local meets 13 out of 23 state indicators while TPS meets only 4. In addition, Washington Local's Performance Index ranks 92 out of 120 while TPS lags behind at 76. We need to indentify the factors behind Washington Local's successes and replicate them throughout the Toledo Public School System.

In August 2007, Jack Ford asked in his column with the Sojourner's Truth :

And, why are there two separate public school systems in Toledo?

In July 2007, the Toledo City Paper's Dildo column said :

Combine school districts into a county-wide school system. The redundancy inherent in every little township having its own schools, with its own transportation, cafeteria, and administrative systems boggles the mind. Cost savings would be automatic, as would a leveling of educational options for kids. Turf protection is the only reason we can fathom for not supporting this idea. Are the townships and 'burbs that worried about their little fiefdoms?

When it comes to anything related to cooperating with Toledo, it's wise for the other communities to look out for their own best interests. After all, that's the thinking of the mayor of Toledo about the other communities.

posted by jr on Aug 27, 2008 at 01:07:23 pm     #

why do students in some TPS schools perform much better than students in other TPS schools?

The only correlation I've seen that makes sense is money. And no, I'm not referring to money spent per pupil--but instead, family income. If you want to improve education in the US (or locally), you can start with addressing poverty.

posted by pink_slip on Aug 27, 2008 at 03:16:45 pm     #

pink_slip - amen

posted by SensorG on Aug 27, 2008 at 04:01:15 pm     #

pink_slip, you said above :

If the student is not doing well, then they have the choice to study harder. The parents can choose to get more involved with the child's education.

If public school is "free" what does poverty have to do with a child studying harder? Parental involvement doesn't always mean helping the child with homework. It can mean making sure the child goes to school, making sure the child attempts the homework, parent talking with the teachers, and having the child attend a tutoring program if necessary. And I don't see what poverty has to do with this kind of parental involvement.

Example :

From a Jun 29, 2004 Toledo Talk thread titled More evidence that parents are at fault? that pointed to a Jun 26, 2004 Blade story titled Bulk of TPS students ignore free test help From the 2004 Blade story:

When the state gave Toledo Public Schools $380,000 to prepare high school students for the Ohio Graduation Test, administrators were eager to help the students get ready. They scheduled Saturday sessions, before and after-school workshops, and summer programs. All were free. But just a handful of students turned out for the programs, school administrators said.

At the East Toledo school, about 15 students are attending a three-week, half-day summer session focusing on all areas of the test. An additional 20 students took advantage of some before and after-school tutoring in March and April, with another 30 students in Saturday sessions during February, said Robin Wheatley, assistant principal of curriculum and instruction. But those 70 students were among hundreds invited.

"I was extremely disappointed," Miss Wheatley said. "I sent letters to the parents saying, 'Your student refused to be tutored.'"

Teachers called parents at all times of the day to inform them about the free summer session and sent letters explaining the test and the extra help students could get.

At Scott High School, about 46 of the roughly 180 invited students attended the summer sessions that focused on mathematics and reading, said Jose Hernandez, the summer program coordinator. "We send out a letter to parents. We call parents. We talk to parents at freshman meetings," he said. "We have incentive packages - T-shirts and things like that. Right now, we're getting the kids who really want to improve."

In the above example, it appears TPS officials did all they could. What does poverty have to do with this example? All the parents had to do was get their kid to the summer school. Sure, getting a child to attend summer school is tough, but that's when tough love from the parent is required.

Aug 27, 2008 - Toledo Blade - Toledo's household income ranks among poorest cities :

The top 10 large cities with the lowest median household income in 2007:

1. Detroit $28,097
2. Cleveland $28,512
3. Miami $29,075
4. Buffalo $29,706
5. Pittsburgh $32,363
6. Cincinnati $33,006
7. St. Louis $34,191
8. Newark, N.J. $34,452
9. Memphis $35,143
10. Toledo $35,216

[Toledo's] poverty rate - 23 percent - stayed about the same, and the median income went up by about 0.5 percent compared to 2006. But with the nation's median household income rising by 1.9 percent, Toledo's gains were outpaced by the rest of the country.

Household income is the income of all people over 15 years old living in a single house - whether or not they are related to the owner. All the figures are adjusted for inflation. Mr. Finkbeiner said he was pleased the median income for Toledo had increased in 2007 over 2006.

Radical idea mentioned in this July 2004 Toledo Talk thread titled Paying parents to educate their kids. A cycle-breaker of an idea? Spend extra taxpayer money when the student is young, so the child ultimately graduates high school and gets a good enough job to not be in poverty. Maybe paying parents to parent saves taxpayer money in the long run.

This was an experimental program in Detroit, and I have no idea what the results were.

The lure: Parents are paid to come to monthly classes and work with their child.

The man behind it: Dr. Charles Whitten, a retired distinguished professor and associate dean in Wayne State University's School of Medicine, well-known nationally for his efforts as a sickle-cell disease specialist and for recruiting minorities into medicine. Whitten acknowledges that some may question paying parents to teach their children, but he is adamant that it works.

"We've tried everything else. We found a way to get parents to prepare their children by paying them," [said Dr. Whitten.]

Veronica Morrow, Christian's mother, said she would have signed up for the program regardless of the cash incentive, which was $60 a month for working with the child 15 minutes a day, six days a week.

Whitten said he firmly believes that if parents knew how to teach their children -- and were committed to it -- their kids wouldn't enter kindergarten so far behind. So, with the help of a Wayne State education professor, Whitten created the curriculum.

Many unprepared children are coming from homes where there are few books, few adults reading and few adults reading to their children.

A search on Dr. Charles Whitten showed he died two weeks ago today.

posted by jr on Aug 27, 2008 at 04:39:57 pm     #

Toledo's poverty rate is 23 percent.

From a June 12, 2008 Toledo Blade story :

Read for Literacy, citing U.S. Department of Education data, says that one in five Toledo residents read at or below basic level.

The local library has a Read for Literacy program where volunteers teach adults how to read or how to improve their reading skills.

July 1, 2004 Toledo Blade story titled Toledo: Literacy program makes life richer for many :

After struggling to raise 10 children, LeAnna Faison knew something was still missing in her life. The 65-year-old woman couldn't answer homework questions from her grandchildren because she didn't know how to read. Ms. Faison, through Read for Literacy, Inc., was one of the stars of its awards program last week. She was honored as its Adult Learner of the Year.

Ms. Faison dropped out of school in the eighth grade in Tupelo, Miss., to help her family with chores and make ends meet by picking cotton. She was at a first-grade reading level when she entered Read For Literacy. Now, she can read the newspaper, write letters and use the library. Her tutor Retha Carothers, said the two also read passages from the Bible.

Ms. Kaufman said she has noticed a change in the people approaching Read for Literacy. "We used to see more high school graduates," Ms. Kaufman said. "Now, we're starting to see people who dropped out in the ninth and 10th grades. They weren't able to pass the proficiency test and saw no future and dropped out of school."

posted by jr on Aug 27, 2008 at 05:13:16 pm     #

Thesis: the best predictor for success in education is socioeconomic statis.

posted by Offshore on Aug 28, 2008 at 06:49:33 am     #

Could it also be said that education is the best predictor of future socioeconomic status?

posted by jr on Aug 28, 2008 at 07:07:59 am     #

Yes, the two are complementary.

posted by Offshore on Aug 28, 2008 at 07:19:30 am     #

And I don't see what poverty has to do with this kind of parental involvement.

I don't know what else to tell you, but the correlation is there.

posted by pink_slip on Aug 28, 2008 at 08:11:08 am     #

Financially poor parents can be wonderful parents and greatly involved. But, many impoverished family structures are matriarchal with emphases on survival without a future orientation and education is abstract and not a reality.

posted by Offshore on Aug 28, 2008 at 08:29:01 am     #

"I don't know what else to tell you, but the correlation is there."

Bulk of TPS students ignore free test help

So the above Blade headline for the corresponding TPS story can be explained away because of poverty.

posted by jr on Aug 28, 2008 at 09:29:43 am     #

So pink_slip and Offshore, aren't you making the case FOR school vouchers?

Impoverished students in failing schools can use the voucher money to attend a school with possibly a better learning environment that may allow these impoverished kids to learn more, which will hopefully keep them out of poverty when they become adults.

Does this work 100%? Of course not. But the status quo is clearly not working. Vouchers are an option. It's a chance. It's better than the child remaining in the same failing school.

You keep talking about poverty, but you offer no solutions. Vouchers and paying parents to teach their kids are a couple ideas to help brake the cycle.

Adults with little to no reading skills should spend a year or two in the Read for Literacy program. It would cost these adults nothing except one to two hours a day, two to three days per week. Surely an adult can set aside four hours a week, devoted to learning how to read. With no reading ability, the adult can read at the third or fourth grade level after one year in the program. Naturally, the longer the adult remains in the program, the more advanced the adult becomes at reading.

One of pink_slip's arguments against vouchers was :

If the student is not doing well, then they have the choice to study harder. The parents can choose to get more involved with the child's education.

But now pink_slip is saying parents cannot get involved with their kids' education because of poverty. Then at least allow the child to attend a different school with a voucher, so the kid has some chance to not be like his parents.

I like pink_slip's word choices. The students have the choice to study harder. The parents can choose to get more involved. But let's deny the parents the choice of sending their child to a different school via a taxpayer-funded voucher. I suppose taxpayer dollars won't be used to end poverty.

Is it possible that poor-performing urban public schools are partly to blame for today's poverty rates? So let's keep the kids stranded in some of these failing schools by ending school vouchers.

posted by jr on Aug 28, 2008 at 10:24:43 am     #

"So pink_slip and Offshore, aren't you making the case FOR school vouchers?"

I'm not against school choice but I admittedly need to know more about vouchers before I support to condemn them.

"You keep talking about poverty, but you offer no solutions."

Oh, I don't know about that.

posted by Offshore on Aug 28, 2008 at 10:57:11 am     #

Oops, push wrong button.

I have, and live solutions on a daily basis. But, the differences in our middle-class expectations and that of a culture or poverty cause my skepticism.

posted by Offshore on Aug 28, 2008 at 11:06:25 am     #

So the above Blade headline for the corresponding TPS story can be explained away because of poverty.

In some of those situations, yes. The Blade article mentioned many kids didn't have transportation. I don't know about all of them--I would need more info.

Impoverished students in failing schools can use the voucher money to attend a school with possibly a better learning environment that may allow these impoverished kids to learn more

There is no evidence that this is true. You mentioned parents involvement. Do you think that if you have a kid that is doing poorly, and part of the reason is lack of parental involvement---that suddenly because of vouchers, that parent will become more involved with their child's education?

Vouchers and paying parents to teach their kids are a couple ideas to help brake the cycle.

No they don't. There's no evidence that this is true. You keep implying that taking a child out of one school and putting them in another is going to make them suddenly get better grades. But study after study proves this wrong.

Poverty and Education:

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080817/OPINION03/808170318/-1/LIFE04

http://sitemaker.umich.edu/salas.356/home

posted by pink_slip on Aug 28, 2008 at 11:31:19 am     #

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