Now that the petitions are accepted and Mayor Finkbeiner has been notified, the question remains: Should he step down?
My question is that with nearly 48,000 persons who favored his election in 2005 and just over 29,000 voting for the other guy, would it be proper to allow just over 20,000 persons, fewer than the no votes from 2005, to force him out now? I'm sure he sees it that way also and will wait out the vote in November. Given that, if he enters the race for re-election, he could possibily be un-elected and re-elected on the same ballot. Ain't America beautiful.
Now that the petitions are accepted and Mayor Finkbeiner has been notified, the question remains: Should he step down?
Comments ... #
Your hitting on a great point, that the people voted him in knowing what he was like before, so it would be of no surprise for those same people to both vote him out and back in on the same day.
I've been saying for a while that given the timing of the recall effort it feels almost like wasted effort. Working to get the best person elected should be where the energy is spent, not removing someone that is in the waning days of their time in office.
where do you come up with "just over 20000 people"
There were about 45,000 signatures turned in, the Board of elections just stopped counting when they arrived at the number of valid signatures they needed to have the recall be placed on the ballot
One last time. He got in again PRIMARILY because his opponent was JACKOFF FORD!! Who, after a time, was even more despised! Although a few I would imagine actually believed Sweet Amy- that This was 'the New Carty' and he had changed since his heart surgery(whatever happened to her, anyway? LOL).
Apr 20, 2009 Toledo Blade story titled Mayor Finkbeiner given recall notice :
If Carty ignores this recall notice, and if he seeks re-election, and if he finishes in the top-two in the September primary, it would be interesting if he won the mayoral race and was recalled on the same day in November. If that odd scenario occurrs, who would be mayor? The loser candidate on the November ballot or the Toledo City Council president as of Nov 3, 2009.
And as to the 2005 election numbers:
Carty Finkbeiner ... 15283 ... 36.74%
Jack Ford ... 10910 ... 26.23%
Keith Wilkowski ... 9750 ... 23.44%
Rob Ludeman ... 5386 ... 12.95%
Opal Covey ... 110 ... 0.26%
Don Gozdowski ... 91 ... 0.22%
Martin Okonski ... 64 ... 0.15%
Carty Finkbeiner ... 47,351 ... 61%
Jack Ford ... 29,169 ... 38%
The day after the November 2005 election, Toledo Talk posting titled Recall Mayor Finkbeiner
Excerpts from a December 2004 Toledo Talk posting titled Carty Finkbeiner lovefest :
July 2003 Toledo Blade story about "favorable" ratings for local officials and orgs:
Mr. Ford received the most "favorable" responses with 61 percent of the respondents rating him that way. Former Mayor Carty Finkbeiner had a 53 percent favorable rating, followed by Mr. Silverman with 44 percent, Superintendent Eugene Sanders with 43 percent, the Toledo Area Chamber of Commerce and other business leaders with 42 percent, members of the school board with 34 percent, and leaders of the AFL-CIO at 27 percent.Forty-one percent of respondents said Mr. Ford was "extremely" or "mostly believable," while 38 percent said the same for Mr. Silverman, 37 percent for Mr. Finkbeiner, 35 percent for Dr. Sanders, 29 percent for the chamber and business leaders, 27 percent for the board of education, and 21 percent for the AFL-CIO.
April 2008 posting Poll says Wilkowski crushes Finkbeiner in 2009
September 2008 posting Carty Finkbeiner's approval rating is 17 percent
Weather you like him or dislike him.. he's got a tough time to be mayor of a city that has relied on Automoitive. I think he's doing the best he could.... as for all you "Recall" petition signers... don't bitch about taxes when our tax dollars for the County BOE paid and hired more people to count and verify....All you who signed the petition should be doing something to advocate change in other ways... signing a petition doessn't make you involved...
I HAVE NO RESPECT FOR YOU WHO SIGNED AND FOR YOU WHO SIT QUIETLY....
Isn't it great that while we argue about the budget problems, no one is questioning themselves about the amount of money it will cost the city additionally to count these petitions, the amount of money it will cost tax payers for Carty to challenge these petitions, etc.
The bottom line in my opinion is this. Even if it does happen, the mayor will only be removed for the last 3 months of his term. What good will that do except put Toledo on the national laughing stock news again, and have 3 months of his replacement not really being able to change anything Carty has done.
A supreme waste of time. This group has sat by since 2005 and did nothing, now in the final year of his term they'll throw him out for a lousy max of 3 months. Great planning! I seriously have to question anyone they support for mayor after this timing embarrassment.
I still predict (unless a surprise candidate comes forth)-it will be Bell Vs. Carty . The last two standing. Amy may even come out of hiding again.
And I didn't sign any petition for primarily that reason. I never underestimate the stupidity of my fellow toledoans, particularly in the voting booth.
"... the amount of money it will cost the city additionally to count these petitions ..."
I believe it's Lucas County money not city of Toledo money. Ask the other communities in Lucas County how they feel, and they will probably say that from an entertainment standpoint, this is money well-spent. Besides, it seems the county money always goes to Toledo-based projects anyway. Berkey, Oregon, and Whitehouse residents probably believe this is the best their county dollars have ever been spent. What else would you do with this $15,000? Donate it to the wildly successful Lucas County Improvement Corporation. Nice Web site.
Feb 2009 Blade story :
If you're worried about how county dollars are spent, then do a colonoscopy of the LCIC.
The municipality has to reimburse the Board of Elections for the cost of any special City election.
I don't think Carty should step down. I would be disappointed if he did. He is combative, and will assume that this minority of voters will be overwhelmed at the polls by his supporters. If he loses it will be interesting to see how soon after the first year there is a recall effort against his replacement.
This could get to be a regular effort. In fact, since we will be doing this on a regular basis in the future perhaps we could do away with recalls, and have mayoral elections every year.
Actually a confidence vote for all elected officials every year is not that bad of an idea. If I, as an employee of a private company, cannot fulfill the duties of the job I was hired for, my boss has the right to fire me within the first year. If the Mayor and Council cannot fulfill the duties bestowed upon them when they accepted the job, then we the voters acting as their boss should have the opportunity to fire them as well.
yet another thread disrupted by personal insults by a punk.
The only reason this petition was put out there in the first place was to make sure Carty didn't run again. And since he hasn't announced by now, I doubt that he will.
Question is, who are the TBT people supporting?
Annie, that is a great question. All I've heard them say is anyone is better than Carty. Well, if that was true how did Carty get elected in the first place? But, to be more direct to your point, the TBT people apparently have no idea or plan. They are just unhappy with carty for whatever reason and are more interested in a personal crusade than working to make sure the best person is elected.
~Standard disclaimer: I'm not a Carty supported at all. I just feel that there are better ways to go about changing the city.
"... the TBT people apparently have no idea or plan."
Post your question or concern on the TBT message board .
Maybe not a plan nor an idea, but according to the Take Back Toledo Web site they have goals:
Take Back Toledo is a movement, primarily among the entrepreneurial community, to regain a seat at the table of the Toledo power structure. Our group is not “anti” anything. Rather, we are working toward a community where business can prosper, where jobs are priority one, where unnecessary regulation is eliminated, where petty turf wars are eliminated in favor of a more regional vision, where elected officials truly look to the business community for its opinion and where potential political leaders can go for support if their agenda is aligned with the economic development goals of our leadership.
At the outset we have four primary goals:
1. The Recall of City of Toledo Mayor Carlton Finkbeiner. We have not run across any citizens who feel Mayor Finkbeiner’s stewardship has been beneficial for the community. Huge deficits, failed real estate investments and non-stop confrontations with staff, citizens and other political leaders are routine in the Finkbeiner administration. Even though his administration only has slightly more than a year to run, much additional damage can be done in that time period. We need to act now to cut our losses and keep things from getting even worse. We also need to assure there is not another four year Finkbeiner administration in the future. A Recall will encourage pro-business candidates to run for office in Toledo.
2. Finding and supporting a mayoral candidate who can lead Toledo into the future it deserves. Our area is a wonderful area with tremendous resources. Nearly a century ago it was a hot bed of innovation and progress. It can be that again. The first step is leadership and that leadership will help us overcome those real or perceived obstacles we face. Toledo can be much better than it is. Good leadership is the starting point.
3. We will be examining the need for possible amendments to the City of Toledo charter. Is the “strong mayor” too strong? Does city council need more power as a check and balance? Is the power already there but just not being exercised? Should there be a return to the City Manager form of government? What other changes would be helpful in fostering economic development for our area? These, and many more questions, need to be asked and dealt with in the months ahead.
4. Finally, we are forming a Political Action Committee. We will be seeking donations from the community from those who share our vision and objectives. It is intended that the PAC will be ongoing and will be supporting those candidates who the members feel can help move our community along. We will be focusing on local candidates only. It is our intention to be able to give significant support to those we feel are worthwhile candidates. We want to be as important to those candidates as they are to us. We will also be communicating our agenda to existing office holders in the hope they will heed the wishes of the business community when rendering their decisions.
I'd like to see a new mayor, but I don't know enough about the candidates who are running. I'd like to hear their plans for pulling us out of this budget mess. You either cut spending, or increase taxes or fees to balance the budget. Either way, you're going to piss someone off. But yes, I think it's time we get a mayor who is not so divisive.
jr, I won't comment about the first point from the TBT site, but I will on the second. I'm glad that they acknowledge that a candidate needs to be found and supported. I just wish that this was their primary goal. Up until your post I never heard that from them, the only message that has come across in the news or on the radio has been that they are an anti-Carty group.
To the TBT people, find someone to support before Carty or some other person just as dangerous to the city comes along and scoops up support of the voters. The goal is to make the city the best it can be, not to kick one person to the curb for the possibility of something just as bad to replace them.