Past Due Water Bills a Lien Against Property

Okay – how the heck do you run up a water bill of 7k?

That would take me 20 years!

My Mom was in a care facility and they continued to bill her water, even though she wasn't using any. She was getting fined for not using water + not recycling...cause she was in a care facility...That's the city of Toledo for ya!

The City probably has a policy of not shutting the water of even if they see it has not been in use for a while. This way they can continue to bill and then realize the income when the house is sold. Kinda shady if you ask me.

The way that water bills get run up that high is usually a busted water pipe in one of those homes that has been foreclosed. Although I have had people from the water dept. say that you would be surprised how fast a toilet constantly running or a leaky outdoor faucet can run up the water bill. And, of course, there is always the chance the the water meter is malfunctioning.

Molson, can you imagine the trouble the city would be in if they turned off service just because it hadn’t been used in awhile and someone was still there? It is not the citys responsibility to keep tabs on what the residents are doing. Its up to someone to contact them and tell them what is happening.

Ace – that makes sense. I remember when a former coworker first moved to town they freaked because their first water bill was 600 bucks. They then realized that a bathroom they never used had a running toilet.

But if you don't pay the bill they are out there instantly to shut it off. Do they do the same for a house that is abandoned? Just sayin...

Ace_Face nailed it. Get a lawyer and make sure that the lawyer is very familiar with real estate and house closings. Having a lawyer with you during your house closing is the smartest money you will spend that year.

Ace_Face nailed it. Get a lawyer and make sure that the lawyer is very familiar with real estate and house closings. Having a lawyer with you during your house closing is the smartest money you will spend that year.

I thought that was the whole point of having a title agency go through to make sure their are no liens in the first place. And what Ace posted above, hire a lawyer for the closing.

Putting a lien on a property because some "real" delinquent homeowner (not the sad story of Molsonator's mother) skips out on his bills is to keep that homeowner from selling the property without either him clearing that lien or working a deal with the new owners to pay that lien. At least, that's how I understand it.

Anita takes the gloves off! I enjoyed these great quotes from the county auditor in the Blade article: "...city's billing and collection is so far behind, we cannot assume they are properly placing the liens ... I should not have to do their job ... I am very disturbed with their response and it takes a lot for me to say that publicly ..." Wow!

One way you can run up a water bill is for someone to run it up for you. A guy across the street owned a rental property that was vacant. He got a high water bill. He went to check the property, and found a hose running from his outside faucet to the neighbor's metal pool. He turned off the water inside the house, unhooked the hose, and hoped they would not do it again.

Hoped they wouldn't do it again? I would have called the cops.

Toledolen_, he said/she said. They would have said that they did not do the deed. Just hope they do not break a window to go in, and turn the water on. Better to have the city turn of water if the house is to be empty for a long period of time.

From what I understand, the liens are being placed on the property after the sale is final. So having the best lawyer in town isn't going to help in that case.

oldsendbrdy - if there is a hose going from my house to their pool, it's gonna be pretty cut and dry. I'm pretty sure the cops and prosecuting attorney's will have little problem making it stick.

dell_diva, I'm not an expert by any means, but I worked as a legal secretary for an attorney that got a lot of work from title companies making sure titles were clean and clear (that was a long time ago! and in another state). Liens are placed on property at any point in time, not just at sale. Or rather, the right to place a lien on property can happen at any time. The lawyer I worked for would be hired by the title co.'s to go through reams of paper from the courthouse on a specific plot of land to make sure that at sale it was free and clear of any issues, including liens. There will always be a paper trail for any lien, or right to so. It's up to the buyer to make sure they are cool and in the clear... so that if the property isn't kosher they can use that as a negotiating tool against the seller.

Toledolen_ is right, the liens can be placed at any time. But that's not how you find out if there is the possibility of a lien. You call the water department right before closing and ask if there is an outstanding balance on the property you are buying. They will go ahead and tell you, you don't need proof you are buying the property, are the homeowner, or anything. Plus some title companies are giving people the option of having some money held in escrow until the final water bill is paid, so you know there won't be a surprise later.

Disconnect hoes, add about a quart of used motor oil, reconnect hose. Next time they go to top off the pool they get a nice surprise.

Funny - Thats what Tiger Woods is trying to do. Disconnect hoes....budumsh!

So glad my soon-to-be-lawyer girlfriend (now wife) was with me when I bought my first place. She had the patience to read 200 pages of crap and INSISTED they show us the closing documents before we showed up at the title office so we (or more accurately, she) could read and review them. They were not used to someone asking for the documents up front--we could tell.

Too many people show up at the title office to close and just sign whatever is shoved in front of them because there's so much of it and just signing takes an hour. Its a bad move. Take your time and hire a lawyer. As others have said, paying for 1 or 2 hours of a real estate lawyers time is a hell of a lot cheaper than problems you had no idea existed before signing that big mortgage paper.

While I can not speak for the rest of the country I can tell you that in Toledo, Ohio a new buyer should beware of a possible impending water/sewage lien on their newly purchased home.

Due to the fact that water and sewer bills can become a lien against a property unlike electric and gas bills, I have always made it a practice to contact the water division shortly before closing to see if there may be any pending water liens on a property my client is purchasing, saving my clients thousands of dollars in unknown future liens against their property. This is also known as due diligence, which any good Realtor/real estate agent should be doing. One case of my buyer purchasing a house that was previously purchased by an investor who fixed it up for resale. Imagine the investors surprise when he found out that he had purchased a property that had a lienable water/sewage bill of over $4000.00 on it, that had not been processed until after he purchased the property. Apparently his agent didn't look into potential water liens for his client. Hopefully using an attorney for his closing would have prevented this from occuring. Guess in hindsight that would have been the best thing for this investor to do...use an attorney. Not all Realtors or real estate agents are created equal.

If there is a pending water/sewage lien, I have had them appear on the HUD1 settlement statement as a charge to the seller, as the purchase contract states that the property “…shall show record title to be good and marketable in the name of the Seller, free and clear from material defects, liens and encumbrances…”

The Division of Utilities in Toledo, Ohio billing practices many times run behind the transfer of the property and this is not picked up in a title search and is an exception to title insurance coverage. Your newly purchased property could potentially have a water lien placed upon it for water/sewer usage well before you ever owned it, months after your closing.

Kudos to Lucas County Ohio Auditor, Anita Lopez , for stepping up to the plate and addressing this issue.

At this time, nothing has been finalized is correcting this long running problem so please be sure to work with a Realtor® or real estate agent that is going the extra mile and checking into possible future water liens against the property you are purchasing.

In response to a lien being filed after a closing and the title company not finding it prior. Title companies have an addendum that states they will not cover water/sewer liens that are discovered after closing, that the buyer agrees to and signs.

Water bills in Lucas County continue even though no one is using water at the property. They have a minimum billing charge and the trash pick up charge which is incurred. Doesn't seem like a very fair practice. If the water is turned off, there is a turn on fee, so they have you coming and going.

thanks for the info, connie, I have a house sitting vacant right now, and we were leaving the water on to be used minimally to keep the yard nice for buyers. I should have the water turned off?

ps, I am paying the bills, no problems there, and I will keep paying them till someone buys. we do have neighbors watching the house and no fears of poaching or water line breaks, we check it everyday. :)

Nana, Turning the water off is your call however, when you get a buyer they will most likely want the service on for their home inspection. I believe you will incur a turn on fee if you turn it off. Just had a seller turn off the water and ended up paying $40 to have it turned back on, may be better to just stick it out with the water on. Best of luck to you in the sale of your property.

Ryan in response to your question regarding a $7000 water bill there could be a couple of contributing factors. One being an undiscovered leak, the other being a sewer assessment that has gone unpaid, sometimes from owner to owner until the water company catches up to put a lien against the property. Hope this answers your question.