TPS teachers livin' in the city?

Maybe the board should offer a incentive for them to live within the city & Send their kids to TPS...

...because the incentive of receiving a "top notch education with dedicated supportive faculty" is not there???

Seems that if the product was superior, no incentive would be necessary.

However, requiring that all elective office holders send their children to public schools would be a fun issue to vote on one day.

LOL.. Oldhometown... I have several TPS teachers that live in my neighborhood in the southend.. but know many who also live outside the city.. i'm just curious on the breakdown.

That would help tps tremendously tas well.

I've been told that there's a TPS employee who has listed their current home (in the TPS district) as available to swap for a home in Anthony Wayne, Maumee, or Sylvania districts.

(Disclaimer - I was directed to the ad for the house swap by someone who's aware that I've contemplated moving into Toledo to save money. My current home fits the description of what the homeowner wants in a swap, so the ad was pointed out to me. I was told that the homeowner works for TPS, but don't know the homeowner personally.)

Toledo is a great place to live... I've never heard of swapping homes.. interesting concept. I'll never leave the South End... I love it.

Mom2-Good luck movinging into the city... we welcome you.

I'm not really sure whether I'll end up doing it - the idea of saving money is certainly tempting, but I dread the whole concept of packing and moving. (Especially after being in our home for so many years.)

But the swap idea was tempting though - takes away the worry about selling your existing home. You buy mine, and I'll buy yours. School district isn't a huge concern for me, since my kids go to Catholic school anyhow.

P.S. The home was in the Beverly neighborhood, and I think the ad is still out there. Just in case anyone is interested in looking.

Here's some old info ...

March 2004 thread titled Mayor Ford loses support of black teachers :

Karen Shanahan said in an April 2007 Glass City Jungle thread :

I’m going to put on my devils advocacy hat here…

Aren’t we told constantly that one of the problems with public sector unions is that they get to vote in “their bosses”? In the case of the TPS teachers this doesn’t look like it’s the case since most of them can’t vote for school board members anyway because they live outside of the city.

I hope that's not accurate anymore... i'd like to think that more like 45-55% (at least) live in the city now. I thik that standard is terrible. I hope that is not true...

Or am I wrong for thinking they should be encouraged to live in City?

Do any other school districts encourage and/or require their teachers to live in-district?

I recall that many of my teachers did not live in my community's district when I was a kid.

I know a few teachers who live in Sylvania, but teach in various schools from Oak Harbor to Swanton (and other places in between).

not sure.. the guy down the street from me teaches in Sylvania and when I discussed this with him, he said he wouldn't like living in Sylvania. Feels like he couldn't have his own life without constantly running into a parent or student.. that's why he stayedin South Toledo.

"i'd like to think that more like 45-55% (at least) live in the city now."

That would go against Toledo's population trend.

If declining TPS enrollment means fewer teachers are needed, and the TPS teachers who live outside the city are the ones being cut, then that would increase the percentage living within the city.

You'd also have to account for teachers with a teacher spouse who teaches in another district. Or really, a teacher married to various public employees of different entities. TPS teacher-police officer in another town, etc.

There are a lot of ways where it could get very messy to administer requirements on where employees can live.

(I realize that you're talking about encouraging vs. requiring, of course. I'm just thinking about all of the potential pros/cons/limitations.)

I'm no fan of TPS but your zip code shouldn't be a part of your resume, you should be able to live where you want.

IMO this is a gross invasion of privacy. No one else looks at where other city workers / staff/ etc live relative to the city.

Why is there such a head hunt for teachers?

I am curious how many TPS teachers send their kids to parochial schools instead of the public schools.

Ohio Kimono- must be a TPS teacher LOL. I actually could find those stats for city of Toledo employees.. that's why I was just asking about TPS... Plus TPS is struggling.. why not offer an incentive to live here?

they cant afford salaries let alone incentives.

Toledo used to require its workers to live within the city limits. (I knew a woman who lost her job because she lived 3 blocks outside the city. 3 blocks!)

However, they aren't allowed to do that any more, as we all know.

How do these lowly paid employees afford to live outside Toledo? I am only half joking.

^^Well, I don't think we're only talking about the affluent "outside Toledo" areas...and a starting wage at $35k a year --with built in increases--should be enough money not to live on skid row.

Hoops is hunting the better rabbit.

"Why is there such a head hunt for teachers?

Don't you know? It's because they are overpaid, union members.

however, i will grant, that some of them are overpaid, for example $69,000 for a gym teacher is a bit much.

how long have they been there and do they coach as well? its things like that some people over look. you cant expect any teacher to work for 20 years or more and still be at 40k.

I can understand why there would be interest in seeing the statistic on TPS teachers who send kids to parochial schools.

However, here's a question: If I'm a practicing Catholic who also happened to be a teacher, wouldn't I have the right to choose a religious education for my child?

People choose parochial schools for reasons other than dissatisfaction with the public district. (Me, for example. I know my kids would get a good education in Sylvania schools, but send them to parochial school because I want them to have the religious component as well.)

Wasn't there like 8 shootings last weekend in Toledo? Oh yeah...sounds like a great place to raise a family.

cause that doesnt happen anywhere but here. stay away please.

Ryan name me another place in the area that has 8 shootings in a weekend.

Rossford?? Nope. Sylvania? Nope. Oregon?? Nope. Maumee?? Nope. Perrysburg?? Nope. Bowling Green?? Nope.

Toledo?? Seems like every other weekend.

all of your examples have smaller populations. why do you live to tear toledo down? yes. it sucks, but toledo is not the only city where that crap happens. and it does not happen every week. funny how you include surrounding areas when it benefits your point and leave them out when it benefits your point.

http://www.19actionnews.com/Global/story.asp?S=14872554 "Overnight Toledo shooting makes 13th this week"

http://www.toledoblade.com/Police-Fire/2011/06/17/Police-chief-says-Toledo-a-safe-city.html "In the last 16 days, more than two dozen people have been shot in the city, which "looking at the larger period of time, I did not see anything unusual in this year from the past year," Chief Navarre said.

I see what you mean...it was an isolated incident.

Just calling it the way I see it. Are there nice area's of Toledo left?? Sure but they are few and far between. Same goes for the other cities that I mentioned. Sure there are crappy areas, but you don't get the crime that you get in Toledo. That's why I live in smaller communities and the reason that soon my nearest neighbor will be a mile down the road.

Jim - wow, where have you been? Nope, not a teacher...I sell antiques. thanks for the laugh.

Personally, I tried living in Toledo and left. The schools were seriously under funded, the teachers were trying hard and did make an impact, but the living conditions of being inside Toledo were just terrible. I dont fault anyone for choosing to not live in Toledo.

Toledo schools are not underfunded, there is a disproportionate share going to salaries, pensions and benefits.

OK, how long did you live in Toledo and what school(s) did you send your kid(s)?

As for terrible living conditions... what specifically are you referring to?

"the living conditions of being inside Toledo were just terrible"?

WOW

And as far as people working for the city and living outside its city limits, I see nothing wrong with requiring people that get paid from the taxpayers to live where they work. What incentive is there to do a 'good job' when you have no personal interest in what you do. I have a neighbor that is a teacher for TPS she lives here in Michigan and sent her kids to Catholic schools, I can see the school part but imho she has no vested interest in TPS other than collecting a paycheck. If you count professional and personal ethics, I know she cares and tried to do the best she can, but I sure you cant say that about everyone.

Playing Devil's Advocate here...

What incentive is there to do a 'good job' when you have no personal interest in what you do.

If you're going to look at it from that perspective, what incentive does any employee (other than self-employed) have to do a "good job"?

Also, don't the city employees in Toledo pay Toledo income tax regardless of where they live?

(Caveat: I don't know how the reciprocity thing works - does the tax money stay with Toledo, or go to the community where the employee resides? I work in Toledo, but there's no city income tax in my community so Toledo gets it all.)

Caring about your job, and having work ethics has nothing to do about where you live. I travel for my job, clean into other states and love my job where ever I am. Countless people travel to their job elsewhere, and still care. Living or not living in the immediate area of were you work does not mean you do or do not have work ethic.

Im talking about people paid with tax dollars taken from that community. It would be like having the president reside in Canada.

I wager many employees of the city across the board live all over the NW Ohio area, not just teachers.

That analogy might work when talking about a mayor (both elected officials with political power), but doesn't necessarily make sense if you're talking about a clerk at the water department.

And, as I mentioned above, people employed within the city limits are taxpayers within the community. I am a Toledo taxpayer, even though I'm not a resident.

Anyhow, since the Ohio Supreme Court has already struck down residency requirements as unconstitutional, I suppose this debate isn't going to resolve anything. But it does make for some interesting discussion.

OK, can you answer my questions?

Upso I didnt see your post.

I use to live in apartments off of airport highway. We were their longest lived tenants. We watched the area decay over the span of 5 years from a nice college dorm area for upper grad types down into section 8 housing with gangs and more. The elementary school the kids went to (Halloway) suffered from countless funding problems at the time. The teachers there really did work hard, and the special ed teacher for my stepson made a massive improvement and really changed him for the better, verses the Michigan system we had been in was just passing him along through the system. There are lots of points I could make about the school going downhill as well, but really 5 years of history at a school just isnt something I am up for typing up...now if I had it in photos....

We watched it all decay. Final straw to get us to move was when someone was smoking crack right outside our apartment window (a friend was visiting who is a drug Councillor as a professional, he knew the smell right away), and when I was chased home from the minimart just down the block by several men.

We now live in the country away from it all.

I forgot to mention that real final shift from a "nice area" to "wtf" was when they decided to build section 5 down the block from us. This tanked the value of the apartments in our area, causing our landlords in the area to start offering and accepting section 8 housing.

I don't know if the old apartments I lived in do or don't anymore due to having been out of there for years.

thanks for sharing the info. thats a real bummer

Ohiokimono- HOlloway Elementary is in Holland.. so maybe it wasn't toleod that was bad, maybe it was because it was holland... and generally speaking... apartment life isn't always the greatest anyways... You made it ssound like yo lost your house value because of the area... Tryin looking into an actual neighborhood and livin there.. then you can speak about Toledo honestly. Not to mention, Holloway is not TPS... it's springfield!

Pardon, meant to say Renolds. I can't exactly edit posted comments.

So no, still in Toledo.

To clarify: My step kids went to http://www.tps.org/ at Reynolds elementary School off of airport Highway.

Stepdaughter was K - 4 at Reynolds, stepson 2 - 6. They spent years in TPs, we moved during the summer.

Not to thread-jack too bad...but to further prove my point...Two more shootings in T-town last night. Get over it Ryan, you can't defend the indefensible.

Jim, I lived in Toledo for a total of 7 years. When I lived in two different apt. buildings during two of those years, one was broken into and the other my car was stolen from the parking lot and destroyed by the scum that stole it. I moved into 'Old Orchard' back in '99 and, as kimono states, watched the part of it I lived in turn from a nice professional neighborhood (my next door neighbor was a well known meteorologist for ch. 13, the guy across the street was a doctor, etc.)to a complete mess in those few years we stayed there. The minute those shithole apts. went up on Douglas and the houses started getting rented out instead of owned the place turned into an area unsafe to walk your kids around the block in the evening. We took a 9k loss on our house to get the hell out of Toledo, and it was the best decision I ever made.

My Family roots in Toledo use to live on Orchard Street off of Broadway. Though I am a military child, that little house on Orchard street was "home" no matter where in the world I lived. 4 generations of my family passed through those doors. We watched that neighborhood go from a vibrant working class area where families were raised into the ghetto mess it is now.

We no longer own the home, it was sold off years ago. We had wanted to pass it down from generation to generation. Instead, we deemed the place far too unsafe to raise a family and went elsewhere.

A wise choice. Crime is rampant there, and the neighbors house is now condemned. Tragic. I don't even feel safe driving by it anymore to simply "think" about how things once were.

OhioKimono- Are you always so damn negative? And I bet you (along with many other residetns) just watch things go down the tubess... Think positive.. they are many good things happening in that area currently. I serve on the board of a nonprofit down there. Think positive.. and don't have such a dreadful outlook on toledo.. Remember.. what happens in toledo... WILL & does affect the burbs and NWO all together.

If you review my history on here, I am far from overly negative. I leave positive reviews, do photojournalism about the good things I see and more. I like Toledo, I am also realistic and have lived in it and seen its decay first hand over the span of decades.

You are overly defensive.

I've lived in toledo for decades, and haven't felt as positive about it as I do now. It's all relative! Thanks again for sharing OK!

Sounds like you lived in a shitty neighborhood. Lucky not all of Toledo is like that.

i moved to phoenix and moved right back when i finally realized how awesome toledo is. i especially love my point place neighborhood. toledo, like any city, is what you make it.

and no offense ohiokimono, but you say you live in the country, but stil live in toledo and in a condo complex to boot. that just doesnt make sense unless i am missing something which is totally possible.

Funny thing about condos...they don't have to be located in a city. I know it's shocking, but condos can be built anywhere. Living in the country doesn't mean you live on a farm.

There are plenty of great areas to live in Toledo. There also are several areas of Toledo that should be avoided. You can pretty much replace the word "Toledo" with any other city in this country and those statements would still be true. I'm sick of reading posts about the increase in shootings and equating that to safety in Toledo. ALL of those shootings happened in the hood between the hours of 10pm and 5am. Not anyone in this forum is out in the hood at 1am because we know better. Those who don't know that people get shot in the hood after dark are the ones getting shot. More power to them.

Ryan, no offense....but while we are at it: they also don't build outdoor malls in Ohio much less put them out in the country Cough Levis and Fallen Timbers. And they would never put condos and hotels out in the country with those crazy malls located in the wide open fields either!

Housing and building develops clearly have to stick to rigid stereotypes of placement in relation to development. If a place doesn't follow those stereotypical, well gosh darn clearly its a fib and doesn't exist.

Excuse me while I return to my condo in the nice quiet country township (there's a corn field to my left at the end of the condos I live in. There is nothing but country and farm clean to Chicago at that to my left) and then go shopping at a mall in the middle of a country field. If you want photos of the corn field next to the condos let me know. Heck, even include a specific message I have to write on a piece of paper to hold up in the photo.

I lived in Toledo, and it wasn't for me. I still like the city, but I won't live in it with kids.

I guess I think of country differently. My bad.

I've been Zig Zagging around this post a bit.

In regards to TPS teachers living within city limits...

I am an advocate of common sense. It seems like common sense that teachers should live within the city limits. As a Toledo tax payer part of me is on the edge of my seat ready to take that position. However, after some contemplation... I think that many of the restrictive actions that government is taking is diluting the most essential nutrient for Capitalistic Prosperity which is [Freedom].

If we place restrictions on where people must live to work or what products they can and can't buy we create one of those Chinese Finger traps where the harder you pull the more tightly you are bound. As Health care and Government become more entwined are doctors going to be told where they must live so that there is ample medical resources in areas with higher populations? How about Nurses? Or... will these people be free to live the American dream and choose where they want to live and practice their skill?

It's like my response when people tell me what type of products I should buy under the "guise" of Patriotism when it is their job they worry about.. not my wallet. My response has always been "As long as I'm a Free American I'll buy whatever the *&^% I choose to!"

I say the less we talk about Government's hand in solving our problems the better!

Anyone remember several years ago when the BOE was ready to hire a new superintendent (name was Harner) and then withdrew the offer when the guy refused to buy a house in the district and send his kids to TPS?

Yep...I thought of him when this topic was started as well.

He appears to have done well for himself though. In 2009, he was named Administrator of the Year by the National Association for Gifted Children.

This was in addition to the other national awards that he received before being rejected from the TPS job in 2007, such as being named National Administrator of the Year by the Association of School Librarians in 2004.

But hey, the guy wanted his high school daughter to be able to complete her AP classes, which weren't available at the time in TPS.

I suppose there are people who would say it was worth losing a solid outside candidate with potentially new and innovative ideas though, right?

^ this

He was not a union bulwark so they told him to GTFO.

But hey, the guy wanted his high school daughter to be able to complete her AP classes, which weren't available at the time in TPS.

Are they available now?

I guess they it wouldn't look good for the superintendent to have to send his kid to Central Catholic, Notre Dame, St. Ursula, or MVCDS because it would show the severe shortcomings of TPS. So...rather than improve themselves...much easier to not hire someone with apparently excellent credentials.

Nice.

dbw8906, please refrain from making up stuff about issues you have no inside knowledge of simply because you don't like unions. The teachers' union thoroughly researched Harner (as they do every prospective superintendent candidate) and supported his hiring.

^ this. Dw's foaming at the mouth raving does more harm for his cause then good.